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Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

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Battlefield
Posts: 535

Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#1 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 12:53 pm

Why initiative debuffs or bullets from WH stack? WH+WH or WH+SW (knockdown ability not tactic) etc. My default initiative 209 but after 2 such debuffs my initiative dropped to 47, i saw it and this is noticeable by the increase in the frequency of critical hits. My crit reduction is 28%. There were also questions about other debuffs. it would be nice to check aura resistance debuff with other, does it stack or not (I know it was fixed a couple of years ago).

https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/20706
Last edited by Battlefield on Fri Feb 10, 2023 1:04 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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lemao
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#2 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 1:17 pm

Abilities don´t stack. So 2 iniative debuffs from 1 wh each should not stack (The highest gets applied).
Abilities only stack with tactics and morales. For example zealot m1 armor debuff stacks with zealot armor debuff tactic + marauder armor debuff (Morale + tactic + ability).

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CyunUnderis
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#3 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:03 pm

Did you check your initiative thanks to the command .getstats or with the character window ?

Like @lemao said, two debuff from abilities should not stack. If that's the case because you checked it with .getstats, you recorded the moment or screenshoted combat logs with timestamp, maybe you can open a bug report.

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Battlefield
Posts: 535

Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#4 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:14 pm

CyunUnderis wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:03 pm Did you check your initiative thanks to the command .getstats or with the character window ?

Like @lemao said, two debuff from abilities should not stack. If that's the case because you checked it with .getstats, you recorded the moment or screenshoted combat logs with timestamp, maybe you can open a bug report.
In combat .getstats command does not work ! But i am sure it stacks because i get more criticals hits while my char debuffed from more than 1 WH. I wanted to make a screenshot and was looking for other players but found only 1 and for test need at least 2

rejndjer
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#5 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:24 pm

abilities also stack with armor set bonuses. rdps(engie and sw) have certain sets that give bonus chance to steal initiative from target. my guess is this is what happened to OP, one initiative debuff from ability and other from armor set.

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forsa
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#6 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:30 pm

rejndjer wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:24 pm abilities also stack with armor set bonuses. rdps(engie and sw) have certain sets that give bonus chance to steal initiative from target. my guess is this is what happened to OP, one initiative debuff from ability and other from armor set.
No, abilities on sets are considered "skills".
This can be easily checked on SW who has ini debuff on his range KD and Bestlord/Conq/HV sets.

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CyunUnderis
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#7 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:32 pm

Battlefield wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:14 pm In combat .getstats command does not work !
It does, but you need to untarget the enemy.

rejndjer wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:24 pm abilities also stack with armor set bonuses. rdps(engie and sw) have certain sets that give bonus chance to steal initiative from target. my guess is this is what happened to OP, one initiative debuff from ability and other from armor set.
I guess it will depends of the bonuses, but to me it should not stack. For example, Triumphant/Vanquisher 4p proc on attack does not stack with +% parry skill like Suppression. Same for the proc from weapon like Hand of Mahal that gives a %parry on defense.
So in theory, it should not stack, because it should be considered like a skill.

rejndjer
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#8 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:35 pm

CyunUnderis wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:32 pm

rejndjer wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:24 pm abilities also stack with armor set bonuses. rdps(engie and sw) have certain sets that give bonus chance to steal initiative from target. my guess is this is what happened to OP, one initiative debuff from ability and other from armor set.
I guess it will depends of the bonuses, but to me it should not stack. For example, Triumphant/Vanquisher 4p proc on attack does not stack with +% parry skill like Suppression. Same for the proc from weapon like Hand of Mahal that gives a %parry on defense.
So in theory, it should not stack, because it should be considered like a skill.
i dont know if it should or should not stack, i'm just saying that it IS stacking. if you have engie/sw/sh with that armor set proc go and check it out :)

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Battlefield
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#9 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:44 pm

I does not matter, even if untarget the enemy while the fight continues .getstats command does not work
Last edited by Battlefield on Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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CyunUnderis
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Re: Why initiative debuffs from WH bullets stack?

Post#10 » Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:44 pm

rejndjer wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:35 pm
CyunUnderis wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:32 pm
rejndjer wrote: Thu Feb 09, 2023 2:24 pm abilities also stack with armor set bonuses. rdps(engie and sw) have certain sets that give bonus chance to steal initiative from target. my guess is this is what happened to OP, one initiative debuff from ability and other from armor set.
I guess it will depends of the bonuses, but to me it should not stack. For example, Triumphant/Vanquisher 4p proc on attack does not stack with +% parry skill like Suppression. Same for the proc from weapon like Hand of Mahal that gives a %parry on defense.
So in theory, it should not stack, because it should be considered like a skill.
i dont know if it should or should not stack, i'm just saying that it IS stacking. if you have engie/sw/sh with that armor set proc go and check it out :)
Did you test it ? I don't have this kind of characters, but if you have a SW with Beastlords/Conqueror set, feel free to PM me to test it.

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