[Black Guard]2H Disparity between IB?

[Dreadspectre]

Since there's no other spot to really put this and it's 2H BG play I'll put it here:

So far I've gotten to 10 on my BG and I have to say I feel like already I'm suffering from ability bloat.

I have a BO and CH as well and yeah, there's a lot of stuff they can use as well but it seems more....structured(BO) and freeform(CH)?

I still have more abilities to unlock and use so my hotbar is going to get even more complex.

Do 2H BG's really use all these abilities or do you start pruning some stuff out later on to make the best use of AP/Hatred. So many buff this, debuff that abilities heh.

[TenTonHammer]

welcome to bg

your gonna have a lot of abilities to juggle

[Gobtar]

Since there's no other spot to really put this and it's 2H BG play I'll put it here:

So far I've gotten to 10 on my BG and I have to say I feel like already I'm suffering from ability bloat.

I have a BO and CH as well and yeah, there's a lot of stuff they can use as well but it seems more....structured(BO) and freeform(CH)?

I still have more abilities to unlock and use so my hotbar is going to get even more complex.

Do 2H BG's really use all these abilities or do you start pruning some stuff out later on to make the best use of AP/Hatred. So many buff this, debuff that abilities heh.

You do have alot of reactionary abilites, that are nice: Crushing Anger and Crush the weak are pretty great to have on your tool bar.

You only need Hateful Strike on your bar if you have Terrifying Foe tactic or PvEing otherwise trash it. If you don't have Hastened doom you can do away with murderous wrath. if you are pure DPS in T3-T4 Shield of Rage is not going to do much for you.

[Dreadspectre]

Since there's no other spot to really put this and it's 2H BG play I'll put it here:

So far I've gotten to 10 on my BG and I have to say I feel like already I'm suffering from ability bloat.

I have a BO and CH as well and yeah, there's a lot of stuff they can use as well but it seems more....structured(BO) and freeform(CH)?

I still have more abilities to unlock and use so my hotbar is going to get even more complex.

Do 2H BG's really use all these abilities or do you start pruning some stuff out later on to make the best use of AP/Hatred. So many buff this, debuff that abilities heh.

You do have alot of reactionary abilites, that are nice: Crushing Anger and Crush the weak are pretty great to have on your tool bar.


You only need Hateful Strike on your bar if you have Terrifying Foe tactic or PvEing otherwise trash it. If you don't have Hastened doom you can do away with murderous wrath. if you are pure DPS in T3-T4 Shield of Rage is not going to do much for you.

Really Shield becomes garbage? I feel like I need to use it for solo grinding. I'm still getting mad amounts of my attacks Parried by mobs, even ones 1-2 levels under me. It's mind boggling O.o

You don't use Wrath as main builder? I figured it would be the go to since it ignored armor. What do you use to build Hatred then? Just Feeding on Weakness, Snare, Mind Killer and getting hits/Dark Protector?

[Gobtar]

Really Shield becomes garbage? I feel like I need to use it for solo grinding. I'm still getting mad amounts of my attacks Parried by mobs, even ones 1-2 levels under me. It's mind boggling O.o

You don't use Wrath as main builder? I figured it would be the go to since it ignored armor. What do you use to build Hatred then? Just Feeding on Weakness, Snare, Mind Killer and getting hits/Dark Protector?

SoR is alright for PvE or tank specs, you wont be using it alot if you are DPS, I keep it on my tool bar and still use it, just feel its waste of GCD when you are LOLDEEPS.

Enraged Beatings is the best way of building hatred, brutal smash, FoWeakness, snare, Horrific wound (still usefull even if not at full hatred). Often I will Pitiless strike as soon as I can chained into Enraged Beatings just and I will be close to full hate after that. DPS on a BG is all about going to 100 hate for HW then burning your hate on your attacks then using EB with the crit from burning hate. It's a dance.

[Dreadspectre]

Ah, so you do you recommend dropping CD for EB then? I want to take the Detaunt tactic but with level restraints that means I'd have to get one or the other.

Although I guess I could drop Hastened Doom instead and get CD and EB. I kind of like the idea of fast AA's though, just sounds appealing heh.

[Gobtar]

This is what I run when I feel like doing damage, I also still use a shield because despite my griping in the subject a 5s KD is better than not having one.

http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=bg; ... :;;0:0:0:0:

Run assist with a marauder and you wont feel as bad about losing the wounds debuff. You are still bringing a heal-debuff and Choking fury as well, which are good tools. Choking fury on a Slayer is hilarious! Most MDPS wont have access to a oHD so it's nice to have this, Don't go all Wile E Coyote after a RP, you will get yourself killed if you are DPS.

If you do decide to go 2h tank/Deeps I would suggest this:

http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=bg; ... :;;0:0:0:0:

You can still do decent damage, you have a ton of parry making you a suitable guarder, decent durability...if you notice you are getting focused by BWs pop FoF. Slot Rugged, depending on your set up you wont have enough base toughness to benefit from Terrifying Foe.

Big thing you bring to the table is AoE Snare, it's really nice to have, and MDPS will love you forever (though will ditch you for a BO slotting Big Swinging)

Honestly your damage is not going to be anything to write home about but you can try it...you like the burst from Malice. Atm I think BG work better either in the first spec or pure defensive...I think this carries over into tier 4 but see how you find it.

(This is ALL assuming you want to keep a 2hander which imo is a huge compromise)

[Stinkyweed]

My SW still does outperform my SH.

The thread was locked so that was the end of discussion, but it doesn't change my opinion on how effective the classes are when compared to eachother.

[kok]

Can someone with experience with IB and BG explain to me what the asymmetrical balance is supposed to be between 2H IB and 2H BG?

I'm looking at the career builder and the 2H IG has some really nice abilities not only in function(in the mastery tree I mean) but also are affected by Grudge for damage. None of the BG tree abilities do increased damage based on Hatred and the utilities are different.

Just looking for some insights on what one can do the other cant.

A simple look in skill and you can see that in dmg IB > > BG .( I assume you already know that)
There is NO asymmetrical balance. It is always like this. Mythic haven't been known to create balance game and warhammer is known for order bias and BG been unpopular get the end of the stick,
BG is always a terrible Pvp tank and a good PvE off-tank(It can't get enough monster hate to be good main tank)
That why you never seem a BG in preferred(Group that chose class) premade group.

[Karnuss]

Lol you don't know naoise. He is always angry

Just getting angry if people cannot understand my points, or rather do not want to understand, or don't even feel the need to look at what i actually wrote.

*glaring at a certain Chosen*

Naoise as in Illthalla/Neesha is that you?