Need help with tanking on order

[Stkillinger]

I could use some advice here. I decided to pick up my kotbs again and dancing around with the order zerg but something I keep finding myself in is that I am maybe one of three or four tanks in the wb. What do you do in this situation? With the entire wb consisting of healers and mostly rdps do I just stay back with them? I currently just try to find a mdps and there is usually one slayer or white lion for my guard. Being one of maybe 5 people acting as the front line we all get focused instantly when destro moves forward. it is to my understanding that order needs tanks, and I would like to help with that and see what the other side is like.

SC's are a little different but the same situation, just on a smaller scale.

[verterdegete]

It has always been like that.

I used to play KotBS on Live, and I always felt frustrated for the very same reason. Eventually got sick of it, and switched to Destro. Roleplayed that my knight converted to Chaos, and became a Chosen. Invading the soft bellied Ordos, to punish them for their decadence, not wanting to roll tanks. It felt good.

[Erolgamer]

* Assist a range and apply debuffs to improve his damages
* Always keep an eye on your flanks & Snare + repel ppl trying to reach your range buddies

That's what I'd do and did in few scs with lot of sorcerers They like my resistance debuff

[Axerker]

I play a Chosen, so my advice may be different - but I expect that both Order and Destro RvR the same way, in terms of positioning.

For Destro, all tanks are expected to be at the front, guarding melee only. Occasionally, you'll get knocked out of position (or a ranged character will move up), and you switch your Guard to them if they're getting focused. But primarily you're expected to be in the front, soaking as many hits as you can for the enemies that decide to attack you instead of an ally.

Playing against Order, they have the same approach. Every zerg is always usually 2-6 KotBS, IBs, and SMs in front, charging your ranks. The real positioning comes from whether you break through the line and tank near the enemy ranged characters, or if you stay in the melee brawl. That one is a lot harder to determine, and is different for every situation. Sometimes I'll charge through the line another 20 feet to get to the Bright Wizard or Shadow Warrior to knock them back towards my WB for a free kill.

A lot of Warband zerging is psychological. People make stupid decisions when they see you're past their frontline. Most pug WBs scatter the moment a single Tank gets to the back ranks. If you're playing against a coordinated WB, expect to just get *slowly* nuked down, while they calmly realize you can't really do anything to them. Playing a Tank is more about manipulating player's mentality than actually doing any damage, once you pass the frontline. Retreating will bolster the enemy into thinking they're winning the encounter, and cause them to press forward, which makes your WB cower. This pretty much always ends up with you losing the exchange. Aggression is a key factor in a WB.

Tanks often get the shaft sometimes, because they're expected to run in first, but are never informed when the warband decides its time to high-tail it and run away, leaving you to die - or yelling at you for overextending, when you didn't even move forward. You'll get used to it. Overall, the goal is to soak as much damage as possible for allies, both via Guarding and via enemies not using proper targeting.

You should only ever Snare or Knockback enemy Tanks, never engage with them. Neither you or them will be able to deal any damage to each other, so your goal is to keep them CC'd to stop locking up your Healers/DPS. Hold the Line is pretty much your best friend when your CC's are on cooldown. The 15% Dodge/Disrupt can really add a lot of survivability to your Group (not the entire WB, just your Group) if you can position well enough. Its a bit difficult, as the buff goes directly behind you, but backpedaling makes you move at like 20% movespeed. So you can turn and run (while channeling), to increase only your survival, or slowly back away to help your Group, while you most likely will die because the enemy WB has caught up to you by now. If you die to save 2 Group members, you've done your job. Sometimes you can make it out alive still, depending on the situation.

TL;DR: Sit at the front, expect to get left behind a lot when your Warband decides its time to become cowards despite it being 25 (you) vs 10 (them).

[Stkillinger]

One of my gripes with WAR is how fast people are to retreat. I understand just from observing wbs how the frontline acts and how tanks act, but that is under ideal conditions with a good tank-healer-dps ratio.

And @Axerker that is helpful and I have come to realize I will be the sacrificial punching bag that the warband needs. As far as running to the enemy line goes it is very rare for me since I don't find many people to go in with so I have been staying around the backline punting and snaring. I need to know something about priority. Tanks can lock up healers but dps can hurt them. Which one takes priority if a tank and mdps run to the backline? If I can cc lock one. I notice destro melee duos a lot and this is a common occurrence

[peterthepan3]

Retreat is better in most cases than standing still and dying. Situational awareness is something that is severely lacking in RoR.

[GodlessCrom]

^what Peter said. In my experience, too many people are enamored with dying fruitlessly to "hold the line" or some other bull ****, when they could just as easily run away and regroup rather than gifting enemy renown and medals.

[Axerker]

Spoiler:

One of my gripes with WAR is how fast people are to retreat. I understand just from observing wbs how the frontline acts and how tanks act, but that is under ideal conditions with a good tank-healer-dps ratio.

And @Axerker that is helpful and I have come to realize I will be the sacrificial punching bag that the warband needs. As far as running to the enemy line goes it is very rare for me since I don't find many people to go in with so I have been staying around the backline punting and snaring. I need to know something about priority. Tanks can lock up healers but dps can hurt them. Which one takes priority if a tank and mdps run to the backline? If I can cc lock one. I notice destro melee duos a lot and this is a common occurrence

Yeah, people retreat too easily. There is a time and a place for it, and that is when you know conditions are unfavorable. A lot of pug WBs tend to retreat even when conditions are favorable, or even guaranteed. That's when its a bit annoying as the tank.

It all depends on how much you can tank, and how reliable your healers are (or how much attention they are paying to you). I'll often run through the frontlines, and sometimes I die doing so. Other times, a healer has my back, and I can sit there with 20 people unloading on me long enough for the tide to break. If you make it to the backline, its honestly primarily proximity. You don't want to waste 15 seconds tabbing through enemies until you find a Bright Wizard because you hate them. You want to get the nearest high-priority target (either a ranged DPS or a healer, either is fine), and try to CC them. I would prioritize Knockdowns on healers and Snares on ranged DPS. Snares won't really do much against a healer, unless your team is on them. A Snared healer can still heal, a knocked-down one can't. Ranged DPS rely on being outside of melee range, so a Snare is pretty deadly on them. Even if they jump away, Snares usually last long enough for you to catch up to them and re-apply.


Overall, its all in-the-moment decisions. Mistakes happen, or things you regret. No big deal, just do whatever you can. Fail as little as possible, and succeed as often as you can.

[dansari]

I couldn't imagine tanking in a pug warband. You *need* a voice in your ear saying "OK, time to fall back" if you're pushed too far forward. You will also have an inefficient time tanking if you have a)No melee to guard while pushing, b)Not many tanks near you to push. That's why warbands are built in certain ways. I guess I'm not helping much... basically: focus on CC, HTL is your friend, Guard is your #1 priority, keep your head on a swivel.

[Axerker]

^what Peter said. In my experience, too many people are enamored with dying fruitlessly to "hold the line" or some other bull ****, when they could just as easily run away and regroup rather than gifting enemy renown and medals.

I definitely agree with both of you. The problem is that most leaders retreat even when its certain they would wipe the enemy WB. If you don't know you are going to win, play it by ear. If you know you're going to lose, retreat.

I agree that a lot of players just want to go down in a blaze of glory!, unfortunately. That walk back from the WC ain't no joke, though...

My main problem with people retreating when you know you can win the encounter is that it immediately turns the tides against you. Its nearly impossible to lose an encounter against a retreating team. They're not doing damage or anything, just waddling ducks trying to get away while you slowly kill them off. Once the enemy sees you start retreating, they immediately bolster themselves and turn around to wipe you out, even if they are severely outnumbered. And they'll succeed every time.

So there's a great time to retreat, but there's also definitely a wrong time to do so.