Return of Reckoning

There is no "HPS" stat in the game.

What's being referred to here is "Healing Bonus", which you can see on your character sheet.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Your Willpower and Healing Power are added together then divided by 5 and this creates your "Healing Bonus".

Every ability has it's own scaling factor for this "healing bonus", often referred to as PSM (Primary Stat Multiplier) and historically, it was very often based on cast time. Instant abilities would use 1.5x your Healing Bonus (probably due to intended 1.5s gcd), a 2s cast would use 2x, so on and so forth. On RoR, that's not necessarily true anymore as a lot of PSMs were changed, and quite a few get changed without even going in the patch notes.

A heals value is: Ability Base + Mastery Level + PSM bonus

Zomega touched on this but every ability has a base value, then a mastery level (25 base at level 40 in addition to how many points you have in the relevant tree, or simply Mastery Level 40 if it's a core ability), and then your character's scaling.

Examples of Mastery Level:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

On the subject of "Healing Bonus" vs Critical Chance: It's quite easy to calculate. If you have 170 Healing Bonus and you add another 30? How much more healing are you doing represented by %? You have to test on an ability by ability basis as the result will be different.

How do you test for average output increase for crit chance? You compare your average output if you deal a crit vs output if non-crit then assign percentages. You can then do that with different crit values and compare the differences to see how your output changes on average. Sound complicated? It's a lot of math to do, I recommend making a spreadsheet for it.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

What is the general consensus for RoR?

First off, any critical hit without additional modifier will deal 135% to 155% at random, so we average at 145%. That's your critical effect, Critical Damage Multiplier, term it as you will. Through our last testing, we have determined that healers have a base 10% chance to critically heal. This makes sense as heals do not interact with the initiative stat so some bonus is needed, otherwise a low level healer would never achieve a critical.

Heal crit in many cases is what people stack on most healers because you can get enough of it that it becomes a reliable output stat, especially if stacking hots because your chance of at least 1 of the outputs achieving critical is much higher. We use the Binomial equation to track this, which tells us "The probability of exactly x successes on n repeated trials in an experiment which has two possible outcomes." The 2 outcomes being you either crit or you don't.

https://stattrek.com/online-calculator/binomial < There's a calculator that I like.

If you are in a group, healing 6 people, all taking equal damage, crit can be quite good because your chance of achieving crit on at least 1 target is quite high, using my zealot as an example:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

95% chance to critical at least 1 target and a 77% chance to crit at least 2 targets at random? Seems good.

You can then apply this to heals that are hitting 12+ people, 24 people, etc.

Crit is also valuable for other reasons, Zealots and Rune Priests increase the healing a target receives when they achieve crit with direct heal, Disciples of Khaine and Warrior Priests gain a self-shield. Any healer with Restorative Burst gets AP back.

The Zealot/Runepriest increased healing is 25%, which is an incredible amount of free healing. For example, My Zealot's Elixir of Dark Blessings value is 1477. With Discipline (a 160 willpower increase) it's 1573. That's a 6.5% increase. We can then determine that to achieve 25% increased healing from stats on that ability, I need 615 willpower. Therefore, stacking a healthy amount of crit and giving every person who heals that target a vast bonus that's difficult to achieve with stats is simply better than stacking more Healing Bonus. *Note that this isn't perfectly accurate as the game's tooltips do not include any Power stat, in this case Healing Power, so your raw numbers will be bigger than your tooltips.

All this to say, I don't have the exact answer for what's better, I might make a spreadsheet one day, but I hoped this helped some of you understand the topic better and dispel some of the myths in this thread.

I mean it hasn't changed my personal opinion. Which is that Willpower/STR is better to stack over critical chance unless you proc something like 25% heal increase etc. Because the amount of heal bonus you get from that, far out weights the inefficiencies of investing in crit chance. But all this info has been highly enlightening. My main focus really was to determine the exact benefits of increasing crit vs increasing willpower. And which was the better to invest in if you had nothing procing off crits.

Well someone else pointed out the differences above. Scaling can be odd, especially in the case of book wp/chalice dok. They have some pretty severe scaling issues in some cases that makes either crit or willpower far more efficient than the other. He showed some examples and I simply don't want to spend the time to do any of it now. Warrior Priest / Dok as cast healer needs a rework anyways.

the 25% increased healing doesn't change the scaling of Heal Bonus vs Crit, it scales them both by 25%, thus their values don't change.

Crit can start to get a lot more value where the binomial comes into play as I pointed out with the Group Heal math, which is also true on a ST if you are using your heal-over-times as well, you're healing a target up to 3-4 times in a timestamp and in a 3s window you can have sometimes 10 unique heal effects on them.

I won't comment on crit vs willpower directly until I do the math myself.

Uchoo wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:59 pm There is no "HPS" stat in the game.

What's being referred to here is "Healing Bonus", which you can see on your character sheet.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Your Willpower and Healing Power are added together then divided by 5 and this creates your "Healing Bonus".

And the healing bonus is expressed in terms of HPS (healing-per-second), much like the 3 damage bonuses are expressed in terms of DPS (damage-per-second). You're really splitting hairs on this one.






edit: ignore my terrible stats, my Zealot isn't properly specced right now

I'm trying to find a better way of visualising potential healing output including the value of crits. Not sure if this chart is useful or not, and it's kinda pushing Excel to the limit of what it likes to make charts of. The 3 colours represent 3 different stat combos so you can see them side by side. 100 entries on the X axis representing a crit or not. The long solid bars to the left represent the range of the heal done if it crit, and the tiny flat lines towards the right represent the fixed healing if it doesn't crit. The Y axis the the amount healed. The crits have long solid bars to represent the crit heal multiplier range of 1.35x to 1.55x.

View it in its own tab at full size as this is a pretty crappy graph, but I wanted to visually see the frequency of crits and their value compared to non-crits for the 3 builds. All 3 are based on Touch of the Divine, as seems to be our main example for this thread...

https://i.imgur.com/Pd9Mv8k.png

The faint bars under the really solid ones are just to make it easier to scan down to the X axis.

I made little table, where i calculated what is best to stack for warrior priest for raw healing output. This should answer the original question about "what is better for WP, chance to critically heal or willpower?" The answer is willpower for WP, healing crit for AM and crit for RP.
Table: https://ibb.co/f98wLFd

Xameleon wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 7:19 am I made little table, where i calculated what is best to stack for warrior priest for raw healing output. This should answer the original question about "what is better for WP, chance to critically heal or willpower?" The answer is willpower for WP, healing crit for AM and crit for RP.
Table: https://ibb.co/f98wLFd

Sorry for my ignorance but I don't understand where you're getting your base healing from and multiplier from? Base healing means no willpower at all influencing the ability healing. So that means TOTD is something like 300 base healing without any modifiers. Then it's a case of 300 + (44.2 * HPSM) = 350. Which as far as my math goes is 1.13.

HPS isn't expressed anywhere in game or a phrase that was used by any dev that I can remember. Standardization is hairs worth splitting.

Scottx125 wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 3:10 pm
Sorry for my ignorance but I don't understand where you're getting your base healing from and multiplier from?

The Base Healing of an ability is pretty easy to figure out. You figure out how much tooltip you are getting from Willpower, then use that to find out what the heal would be with 0 Willpower. You then add or remove points from the tree to see the value of 1 point of mastery. You then use that to find out what the heal would be with both 0 willpower and 0 mastery, that is your base.

Uchoo wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 11:19 pm

Scottx125 wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 3:10 pm
Sorry for my ignorance but I don't understand where you're getting your base healing from and multiplier from?

The Base Healing of an ability is pretty easy to figure out. You figure out how much tooltip you are getting from Willpower, then use that to find out what the heal would be with 0 Willpower. You then add or remove points from the tree to see the value of 1 point of mastery. You then use that to find out what the heal would be with both 0 willpower and 0 mastery, that is your base.

Yeah but my point is the tooltip value is with the multiplier already applied. So all you have is the HPS and the final heal value. You're missing the base heal value and the multiplier. And I'm calculating all of these assuming no masteries taken. You can't simply do Final heal - HPS (aka bonus heal). Because that's not factoring in the multiplier. Not being rude but there's a lot of numbers and graphs flying around here but not a lot of formulas so that people can test these values themselves.

E.G: If I have 776 willpower (155.2 HPS) healing 699. If I remove the masteries that gives 588. So the mastery scaling is 8.5684 per lvl (13 levels). Then if I remove the HPS that gives me 432.8. But that's wrong. Surely it should be below 349 (221 willpower base). 432.8 is 1.24x more than 349. And if you change the values, the scaling is even stranger, it becomes 1.15 at 647 willpower healing 528..