Mara vs WL

[deslage]

Piercing bite and Gift of Monstrocity are the only OP things on Mara, pounce is the only OP thing on WL.

[Dajciekrwi]

Personally, im worried by directions of all this type of discussions.
I expect from RoR to be a Warhammer Online second chance - not a "BRAND NEW SUPA-DUPA GAME".
First of all - lets make this game what he was in past- then start thinkin what y can change in game and why.
So, all these topic, "Wl vs Mara", "WL vs Chosen", or "WL versus 6 man party & Keep Lord alone" are useless.
Wanna mirros or winning against all - Mortal Combat waiting for you.

[Penril]

Personally, im worried by directions of all this type of discussions.
I expect from RoR to be a Warhammer Online second chance - not a "BRAND NEW SUPA-DUPA GAME".
First of all - lets make this game what he was in past- then start thinkin what y can change in game and why.
So, all these topic, "Wl vs Mara", "WL vs Chosen", or "WL versus 6 man party & Keep Lord alone" are useless.
Wanna mirros or winning against all - Mortal Combat waiting for you.

That is exactly what the Devs have planned: make RoR as close to WAR live as possible, and only once that is accomplished, start making other changes. Which is the reason why any balance change will have to wait until T4 is released.

Having said that, WAR wasn't perfect. It had several balance problems (between archetypes and realms). I would expect several changes in the future.

[TenTonHammer]

WE wasn't nerfed; it was fixed as per how it performed on live. Come T4, and it will be very good in capable hands again. Loads of classes pale in comparison to Marauder; that's nothing new.

i havnt been on the up and up of all things RoR of the late

what was changed about WE?

[Penril]

Witchbrew maybe? Idk, just guessing. Someone linked this yesterday on another thread:

https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/2714

[jorgemarco]

https://web.archive.org/web/20081022233 ... 0:9:672:25

After i saw that i saw too the old WE. Thats the idea of how mele assasins should be, but in this game like in many others, classes are destroyed cause casters players that cry a lot and not only destroy funny classes, destroy games absolutely.

[Scrilian]

Link is kinda broken, but old WE must've been fun as hell

[jorgemarco]

Should be... now is an extrange class with extrange tools for an assasin. But i think is more funny bomb squads and AM deleting all , i just cant hunt with my we, mostly all classes spitin my face after im dead.

[Annaise16]

The WL class is strong in every situation except 6v6, and their only problem in 6v6 is loss of damage when the pet is killed. To fix that, you just need to make sure that the Loner build provides the same amount of dps as the pet builds in end game gear. That shouldn't be too hard to do.

The WL is able to keep his damage up after his pet got killed in a 6vs6 enviroment simply by slotting Revenge. A tactic you seem to overlook/underestimate completely. 50% damage for 10 out of 15 seconds before the WL can be respawned. If you have doubts regarding its viability check out my twitch (6vs6 against Don't Panic).

Revenge would be taking the place of another dps tactic. This would cost the WL about 10% of its dps when the pet is alive. When the pet dies, the WL loses about a third of its dps. So the 50% damage buff from Revenge is returning the toon's dps only back to its original level, the original level that is about 10% lower than it would have if it wasn't forced to waste a tactic slot on Revenge.

So, if the WL is looking to 6v6, they can give up the unneeded (in this context) utility of Silence and Fetch for the guaranteed dps provided by Loner. Loner is normally also used when aoe damage is prevalent because the pet has no chance against that.

Calling any kind of crowd control such as fetch unneeded is a bit dubious. At the end of the day it's your opinion and i have to respect it. On the other hand i (personally) wouldn't call it useless.

Apart from that, the 65 ft range on their Pull was always an impediment to the two sides closing the gap in rvr. This was because few on order were stupid enough to be the first to step forward and be pulled into the destro ranks where they would be immediately killed. A shorter pull range will bring the two sides closer together during stand-offs. That brings the dps into play because they have something to target other than defensive tanks.

What about 2 100 feet range kd's which can be used in the same way (to zerg down people)? While Terrible Embrace is quite obvious and can be rupted easy by tanks, the range kd is pretty much unexpected and can come from any SW/BW inside the zerg. Also going into 65f infront of the enemy zerg to pull will automatically force the marauder into engi's pull / sw+bw kd range.

I have no problem with the range of the ranged knockdowns being reduced. I have advocated this previously. The topic here, however, is marauders, not rdps.

Piercing Bite was also massively overpowered. It was easily the best tactic in game when the Marauder's target had medium or heavy armor. In those situations, it delivered up to twice as much extra damage as any other dps tactic. In terms of armor penetration, it was delivering the equivalent of about 300 extra points of Weapon Skill.

I think i covered the situation of Piercing Bite in my previous post. Nothing more to say.

The difference between Warpforged and sovereign armor % values isn't that large. PB is still going to deliver much more extra damage against heavy and medium armor toons than any other dps tactic.

[Toldavf]

The curse of khaine tactic always makes me laugh when I see it what the hell where they thinking with that.