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Heal/Crit calculations.

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Omegus
Posts: 1530

Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#31 » Sat May 06, 2023 4:22 pm

Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 12:57 pm
Omegus wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 11:35 am Firstly, 5 willpower with a 1.4 multiplier becomes 7 willpower, not 9 willpower. Anyway...

5 willpower = 1 "healing per second" (HPS), so 800 willpower is 160 (HPS). The HPS stat is meaningless on its own, but each ability has an HPS multiplier which determines how much bonus healing it gets from the HPS stat, much like how offensive abilities get damage bonus from the melee/ranged/magic DPS bonus (which is based on strength/ballistic skill/intelligence) with a per-ability multiplier. When calculating the non-crit healing value, the formula is:
Oh my god I can't believe I made that mistake, shows the issue of doing maths at 3am in the morning :D. That makes crit even worse >.<.
Worse in terms of improving willpower? Yes, but you need to remember it also improves the base healing which is a significant part of the actual healing done.
Also I've noticed something weird. I decided to do all values from no gear and then slowly increased the amount of willpower. The data from the wiki is wrong now I realise. I've just plotted a bunch of data and realised it's diminishing returns. So I asked chat GPT to figure out an optimal spread of Crit to willpower. And from what I've seen it's a 7:1 ratio of willpower to crit. Willpower being around 700-800 and crit being between 30-40%.
Willpower does not have diminishing returns. Each ability scales the healing-per-second bonus granted by willpower + healing power differently, but it is still linear. 800 willpower+healing power will provide twice as much bonus healing as 400 willpower+healing power does, unless the HPS multiplier is zero. That bonus healing is then added to the ability base healing, and the total amount is affected by the crit multiplier.

Stop asking ChatGPT for things ffs
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Scottx125
Posts: 976

Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#32 » Sat May 06, 2023 4:46 pm

Omegus wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:22 pm
Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 12:57 pm
Omegus wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 11:35 am Firstly, 5 willpower with a 1.4 multiplier becomes 7 willpower, not 9 willpower. Anyway...

5 willpower = 1 "healing per second" (HPS), so 800 willpower is 160 (HPS). The HPS stat is meaningless on its own, but each ability has an HPS multiplier which determines how much bonus healing it gets from the HPS stat, much like how offensive abilities get damage bonus from the melee/ranged/magic DPS bonus (which is based on strength/ballistic skill/intelligence) with a per-ability multiplier. When calculating the non-crit healing value, the formula is:
Oh my god I can't believe I made that mistake, shows the issue of doing maths at 3am in the morning :D. That makes crit even worse >.<.
Worse in terms of improving willpower? Yes, but you need to remember it also improves the base healing which is a significant part of the actual healing done.
Also I've noticed something weird. I decided to do all values from no gear and then slowly increased the amount of willpower. The data from the wiki is wrong now I realise. I've just plotted a bunch of data and realised it's diminishing returns. So I asked chat GPT to figure out an optimal spread of Crit to willpower. And from what I've seen it's a 7:1 ratio of willpower to crit. Willpower being around 700-800 and crit being between 30-40%.
Willpower does not have diminishing returns. Each ability scales the healing-per-second bonus granted by willpower + healing power differently, but it is still linear. 800 willpower+healing power will provide twice as much bonus healing as 400 willpower+healing power does, unless the HPS multiplier is zero. That bonus healing is then added to the ability base healing, and the total amount is affected by the crit multiplier.

Stop asking ChatGPT for things ffs
This isn't chat GPT. This is calculation. I made a mistake when a piece of gear had healpower on it instead of pure willpower. My mistake.
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Omegus
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#33 » Sat May 06, 2023 4:52 pm

Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:46 pmThis isn't chat GPT. This is calculation. I made a mistake when a piece of gear had healpower on it instead of pure willpower. My mistake.
For healing output, willpower and healing power are identical (unless softcapped at willpower).
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Scottx125
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#34 » Sat May 06, 2023 6:38 pm

Omegus wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:52 pm
Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:46 pmThis isn't chat GPT. This is calculation. I made a mistake when a piece of gear had healpower on it instead of pure willpower. My mistake.
For healing output, willpower and healing power are identical (unless softcapped at willpower).
Yeah I know. I was calculating it thinking it was just willpower. And was confused when it was not linear because it was saying there was more healing and I missed the fact that my gear had some healpower on it :lol:.
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Omegus
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#35 » Sat May 06, 2023 11:29 pm

Checking back through notes, I'm pretty sure the critical heal multipler range is actually 1.35 to 1.55, so the average would be 1.45 and not 1.4, which would also affect the calculations when working out the average healing output per cast.
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Omegus
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#36 » Sun May 07, 2023 12:05 am

Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 6:38 pm
Omegus wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:52 pm
Scottx125 wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 4:46 pmThis isn't chat GPT. This is calculation. I made a mistake when a piece of gear had healpower on it instead of pure willpower. My mistake.
For healing output, willpower and healing power are identical (unless softcapped at willpower).
Yeah I know. I was calculating it thinking it was just willpower. And was confused when it was not linear because it was saying there was more healing and I missed the fact that my gear had some healpower on it :lol:.
I made a table comparing Willpower+Healing Power in increments of 20 vs crit chance in increments of 2% for Touch of the Divine based on it being rank 38 (mastery rank 13), using an average crit heal value multiplier of 1.45 (in between the crit range of 1.35 to 1.55). This will give the average heal done per cast, factoring in the chance to crit and the average heal multiplier if it does crit. 99.34% sure this is correct. You might need to open the image in a new tab to view it properly.
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Xameleon
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#37 » Sun May 07, 2023 7:50 am

Thank you very much for such beautiful table! Is there a table where i can check HSP multiplier for every healing ability? Or at least for AM, really curious to see calculations just as above, but for Energy of Vaul.

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Scottx125
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#38 » Sun May 07, 2023 9:26 am

Wow that's incredible. I'm fairly certain it's 1.3-1.5 crit but I'll take it 😉. But looking at this I feel it confirms my conclusion that unless you have something that procs from crits. Willpower is better. Esp for WP.
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BluIzLucky
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#39 » Sun May 07, 2023 10:38 am

Cool charts Omegus, base crit should be 10% though as you get that for free :)


Xameleon wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 7:50 am Thank you very much for such beautiful table! Is there a table where i can check HSP multiplier for every healing ability? Or at least for AM, really curious to see calculations just as above, but for Energy of Vaul.
EoV has no Willpower scaling, but you could do a int vs heal crit chart.
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Omegus
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Re: Heal/Crit calculations.

Post#40 » Sun May 07, 2023 12:01 pm

BluIzLucky wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:38 am Cool charts Omegus, base crit should be 10% though as you get that for free :)
I left it off as I've heard people say it's 5%, and others say it's 10%. Is it definitely 10%?
Scottx125 wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 9:26 am Wow that's incredible. I'm fairly certain it's 1.3-1.5 crit but I'll take it 😉. But looking at this I feel it confirms my conclusion that unless you have something that procs from crits. Willpower is better. Esp for WP.
Don't forget that this is just an average. The whole purpose of crits isn't just procs but is getting big surges of (admittedly) random healing.

In ROR, most normal healing will fail to keep someone alive if that person is not also protected by damage reduction buffs (either things like guard, or even reducing the enemy's damage). You're hoping for a big spike of crit heals to keep that person alive until the damage reduction buffs/debuffs get applied by the tanks, at which point we transition from mitigating lethal amounts of spike damage before it drops the remaining hitpoints to zero to more long-term consistant healing where it can be very difficult to kill anyone if the correct mitigation buffs/debuffs are being applied. High crit builds help out during the initial panic/spike phase, and still provide enough sustained healing output outside of the spike phase as evidenced by literally years of this game being played with crit heal builds.

It also very much depends on what you are sacrificing to get those stats. It is very very very very rare that you have to choice between willpower/healing power or heal crit on gear. Almost always it is a case of sacrificing a little bit of willpower/healing power to gain 2% healing crit, and in my experience the small amount of willpower/healing power sacrificed is usually worth the overall boost to heal crit and healing output in general.
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