Are you ever going to address ridiculous advantage Destruction has in sieges?

[wardfan220]

There are a bunch of partially tangled issues here:

1. Can it be fixed?

The answer is clearly no.

2. Does Order have a different ability that gives them an advantage in these scenarios?

I am not aware of it but others may have something they'd like to suggest.

3. Related, is the ability realm balanced i.e. does Order have a direct analog?

It does not on any class.


I am not in favor of removing abilities. I actually think pulls are good for the game and add flavor. But I would absolutely support making an analog of GTDC available to Order. My own preference here would be a new tactic for SM that turns "Gusting Wind" (aoe punt) into "Cyclonic Vortex" (aoe pull). But I'm biased there.

I don't even care if Order gets the same skill. What I want is to be able to rez. If the pull(and let's be honest ALL of destro pulls pull through walls) is allowed through the keep door, then so should resses, it's literally that simple.

[Shieldslam]

This has been going on for ages and a few people seem to realize while the rest throws **** around coping and screaming "skill/positional issue".

Destro:
1. AOEpull + 20% mspeed while channeling on 30s cd, pulling people through walls for years at this point
2. AOEkd 20s cd on a melee dps
3. 6s Unstoppable/Immovable for the entire group + 10% dmg reduction + 30% mspeed on 30s cd

Order:
1. no AOEpull (technically Engi does but so does Magus)
2. no AOEkd
3. same ability but without the mspeed so it's not really worth it

Sure is a surprise why Order wbs have less and less mdps join when they have to deal with all that. But surely nerfed Rampage makes up for all that!
Truly genius to let the melee focused faction have aoepull/kd + unstop with 30% mspeed so they can literally just run through Order squishy ranged line.

[leftayparxoun]

2. Does Order have a different ability that gives them an advantage in these scenarios?

I am not aware of it but others may have something they'd like to suggest.

If "these scenarios" refers to Sieges, then:


When Order is sieging:

• Order's advantage mainly comes from the larger availability of Ranged AOE direct damage and especially DoT abilities; Skirmish SW and (the newly added) Ranged AOE BW don't have mirrors on Destro

• The (newly reworked) Artillery Barrage M4 for Grenadier Engi is VERY strong when it comes to keeping the main door entrance block-free during pushes. Arguably the same can be said for the (newly reworked) SW Scout Tree M4. Neither of them have a Destro mirror.

When Order is defending:

• Essentially the existence of KOTBS with the "Dirty Tricks" and "Focused Mending" tactics makes Order healers life MUCH easier compared to Destro equivalents. Both during pushes and before they happen.

• The (newly reworked) Flame Shield party buff that BWs provide to their parties can be VERY potent when it comes to reducing AOE pressure from AOE DoTs for everyone inside the keep/fort.

Of course Destruction has more unique advantages besides Choppa pull when it comes to sieges (e.g. Tank Morale self-pumps, BO/BG block channels, BG mid-tree M4, BG unique M2, etc.) so in general I'd say both sides have their unique tools for that content. And that's a good thing.

[CountTalabecland]

Destro has life 1000% easier during sieges because of this one ability.

As Destro, there are like 2 Engis on the server with magnet equipped. Not really a threat and at least the engi has to expose themselves to getting pulled during set up.

As Order, there is literally a sea of choppas spamming this ability (no LoS required) on cool down, plus maras pulling whoever shows themselves near the door.

While pushing a door as Order you have no choice but to run into the blender.

The counter that Order has to this was Rampage and that was removed and Order got nothing back.