Preventing regen items from stacking with each others

[Hulgore]

in regards to heal debuffs...

Since day 1 of live they have done absolutely nothing.

The only time they make a damn difference is when you have a whole train on whoever is being focus healed with everyone throwing their heal "debuffs" on them at the same time.

rock, paper, scissors does not apply here. It's more like paper just floats away and never really dies unless rock stomps on it to allow scissors to finally regen all of the AP they used initially to burst them down. But then more paper shows up and it doesn't even matter.

This game (AoR AND RoR) is just one giant life metaphor of "go ahead and try to do what you're meant to do... but don't waste anymore time after that if you don't succeed... because you sure as hell can't out-burst a healer."

Yes I strongly agree with this post

[Akalukz]

Biggot is a pretty harsh word there fella. regen builds are what they are, pretty much they are counters to DPS AM / Sham that have been able to do these exact things since day 1. 90% of the time all you have to do is run away. No one is forcing you to fight a regen tank or regen w/e or regen WL. They matter little in the grand scheme of the game, as we have been told numerous times, the game isn't about 1v1 or 1v3. It's about group play. Side note - outside of the grimwhatever chest i have on 2 charaters i don't run any regen builds.

[Farrul]

I don't see the issue with Regen items, per se, makes itemization more interesting by giving options.
The real issue may be how certain classes can capitalize too much on regen items + health replenishing abilities/other def/ utility tools. It has been poorly balanced or rather not balanced at all and this is the result.

If a tank makes a def/regen build for solo roaming it still has a clear inherent weakness by the nature of being a tank(slow, kitable, avg damage). No matter how tanky it wont survive a gank and will never be a quick killer.

The main offenders will be Def WE/WH and the plague of dot/hot/run away shamans. Stealth classes should never be able to outlast a properly built brawler (hence why they have the advantage of stealth and supporting mechanics) and shamans is too much of a dps/healing/kiting class to be considered balanced in this context.

Regen gear is only half the story and it's actually not even true, when it comes to itemization this game suffers imho only one issue, the imbalance between physical and magical damage channel which is the most obvious in the Magus vs Engineer (Magi about 20% stronger overall as shown by the Fixxer side by side comparison video).

[reynor007]

And how fast U kill averange magus ? 6 sec ?

hmmm, let's do the math, the average mage has 7k hp, i need to hit 5 if invisibility is 4 to get WB,Enfeebling strike, Heart Seeker, wracking pains, envenomed blade, WB. 4gkd, 6 seconds, during this time the mage will take an average of 1.5-2k damage, after that envenomed blade and ruthless assault which, together with WB, will deal about 3180 damage in another 4 seconds,
it turns out that def we spends about 15 seconds to kill an average mage, if the mage does not use a demount and does not use a potion
if you consider dps WE, Heart Seeker and Pierce Armor already deal more than 3k dmg + AA around 1k damage, and you can easily finish your target with ruthless assault, which deals about 400-800 damage per hit, it will take him no more less than 7 seconds
it all looks very cool from the outside, because players like me know where the damage comes from in this class and how to completely counter it.
another question is that WE can attack with WB already active, it's really strong and the duration should be reduced from 60 to 15-20s

I'm sorry that it turned out boring, but I don't know how else to explain to people how wrong they are

[Hulgore]

I do not think that balance regarding dps AM/sham is to make everyone some kind of AM/Sham, and the usual "it's a group play game" answer is the convenient reply to every balance issues that are making the game unplayable/unwinnable outside the press 3-buttons zerg, which is equally boring and frustrating to "fight" than regen builds.

Then the "nothing forces you to fight them" answer is very funny, because, surprisingly, I play this game to fight players, not to run away because they're using the lazy magical build that makes them almost invicible by simply equipping it

[joroth]

I would like to see a counter play to def builds, like making healing debuff affect regen. There's a reason 23% of the population plays a stealth class. We/wh feels almost oppressive in rvr since the 1.5 gcd change. Slowing classes to 1.5 but not adjusting abilities damage for 1.5 has made defense builds run rampant making the game feel awkward sometimes. I think we're in a weird phase between two major patches once we get a rebalance things will feel fine.

[reynor007]

I do not think that balance regarding dps AM/sham is to make everyone some kind of AM/Sham, and the usual "it's a group play game" answer is the convenient reply to every balance issues that are making the game unplayable/unwinnable outside the press 3-buttons zerg, which is equally boring and frustrating to "fight" than regen builds.

Then the "nothing forces you to fight them" answer is very funny, because, surprisingly, I play this game to fight players, not to run away because they're using the lazy magical build that makes them almost invicible by simply equipping it

Have you tried to make a build that can defeat the regen build?

[reynor007]

I would like to see a counter play to def builds, like making healing debuff affect regen. There's a reason 23% of the population plays a stealth class. We/wh feels almost oppressive in rvr since the 1.5 gcd change. Slowing classes to 1.5 but not adjusting abilities damage for 1.5 has made defense builds run rampant making the game feel bad. I think we're in a weird phase between two major patches once we get a rebalance things will feel fine.

yes, maybe then they will finally fix the toughness, which is broken for the umpteenth time
for those who do not know, with a critical hit, tough only works by 50%, from here we get that with a critical damage of 500 strength = 1000 toughness

[SuperStar]

I would like to see a counter play to def builds, like making healing debuff affect regen. There's a reason 23% of the population plays a stealth class. We/wh feels almost oppressive in rvr since the 1.5 gcd change. Slowing classes to 1.5 but not adjusting abilities damage for 1.5 has made defense builds run rampant making the game feel bad. I think we're in a weird phase between two major patches once we get a rebalance things will feel fine.

yes, maybe then they will finally fix the toughness, which is broken for the umpteenth time
for those who do not know, with a critical hit, tough only works by 50%, from here we get that with a critical damage of 500 strength = 1000 toughness

Thx the info i didnt know it. Is it a bug or a hidden not well communicated mechanic?

[Hulgore]

Have you tried to make a build that can defeat the regen build?

Oh yes, at first I thought that I could use a healing debuff. Then I learned that it does not apply on the regen from the items.

So i've come to this conclusion : my solution to counter a regen build is to stack even more regen that the opponent has, so that after 15 minutes of fighting each others one of us will die of boredom