Shaman/AM nerf?

[Bozzax]

- Snare puddles

- Insta ress (killed with changes to M2/stun)

- Morale pumps (AM being better since it triggers on EoV side note same with PIO FotG)

- ST drain that was good now it is more ap management

- Descent healing output (AM is slightly better mostly bc there are no x2 shatter and wild healing and cleansing more 9 vs 8 classes). CDR push both to strong healing and AMs have this more available bc of SMs being meta

- Ok survival tools after latest cast on move changes, shaman a tad better after nerfs to tactics and buff to AM aoe detaunt (way less then ppl make it out to be). In reality RP is the sturdiest most effective kiting healer as well

Both are just “one of those classes” that will be fillers outside of pug wbs

Don’t think this will change and yes a RP/Zele are a way better pick for your wb

[PROsiak]

Sorry for asking silly questions, but i wasn't around in the last past few months when all the changes were happeing.

- Insta ress (killed with changes to M2/stun)

What's with the insta ress? I've been using it the same as always, didn't notice that anything has changed.

- Descent healing output (AM is slightly better mostly bc there are no x2 shatter and wild healing and cleansing more 9 vs 8 classes). CDR push both to strong healing and AMs have this more available bc of SMs being meta

Last i heard playing tank was no meta for order. And with the latest nerf to WW's uptime whn you get the buff it feels more like a pleasant suprise than something you can count on in a regular game.

- Ok survival tools after latest cast on move changes, shaman a tad better after nerfs to tactics and buff to AM aoe detaunt (way less then ppl make it out to be). In reality RP is the sturdiest most effective kiting healer as well

Again, not familiar with all the changes. Isn't aoe detaunt the same as always has been? 30s cd, 5s setback immunity. And what improved for shammies/am's with cast on move changes, when they got hit with inability to cast on move EoV's/FoTG's?

Both are just “one of those classes” that will be fillers outside of pug wbs

And that's the problem, isn't it. They can have very good healing output. I enjoy playing them. But they could get some love when it comes to usefulness to the party as a whole. Puddle is great, but in a typical wb vs wb scenario you hardly need more than 1 am (i'd say you hardly need any, but still pudle/insta res is a nice tool). Morale pump/AoE cleanse? Well, if u get +2 sov bonus and u want to run both EoV/Funnel essence there are no points to even pick that... and they still compete with other tactics.
What i consider a significant buff is the 35% heal increase tactic. It seems like AM/Shammies want to be kept as those indepedent strong burst healers - that fits this kind of playstyle nicely

[Wdova]

“What i consider a significant buff is the 35% heal increase tactic.”

Id You mean tactic that increase healing of Gork’ll Fix It by 35%? There is no room in tactic slots for that and no its not “significant” buff to Shammans heal outpoot.

[PROsiak]

“What i consider a significant buff is the 35% heal increase tactic.”

Id You mean tactic that increase healing of Gork’ll Fix It by 35%? There is no room in tactic slots for that and no its not “significant” buff to Shammans heal outpoot.

And here i thought the 35% heal increase was global, cause on AM's side it says "healing energy" - but that's the name of the ability . Now that i've read it again i feel stupid. Your right, seems like a waste of tactic slot, so no buffs for the poor guys

[Ysaran]

Sorry for asking silly questions, but i wasn't around in the last past few months when all the changes were happeing.

- Insta ress (killed with changes to M2/stun)

What's with the insta ress? I've been using it the same as always, didn't notice that anything has changed.

- Descent healing output (AM is slightly better mostly bc there are no x2 shatter and wild healing and cleansing more 9 vs 8 classes). CDR push both to strong healing and AMs have this more available bc of SMs being meta

Last i heard playing tank was no meta for order. And with the latest nerf to WW's uptime whn you get the buff it feels more like a pleasant suprise than something you can count on in a regular game.

- Ok survival tools after latest cast on move changes, shaman a tad better after nerfs to tactics and buff to AM aoe detaunt (way less then ppl make it out to be). In reality RP is the sturdiest most effective kiting healer as well

Again, not familiar with all the changes. Isn't aoe detaunt the same as always has been? 30s cd, 5s setback immunity. And what improved for shammies/am's with cast on move changes, when they got hit with inability to cast on move EoV's/FoTG's?

Both are just “one of those classes” that will be fillers outside of pug wbs

And that's the problem, isn't it. They can have very good healing output. I enjoy playing them. But they could get some love when it comes to usefulness to the party as a whole. Puddle is great, but in a typical wb vs wb scenario you hardly need more than 1 am (i'd say you hardly need any, but still pudle/insta res is a nice tool). Morale pump/AoE cleanse? Well, if u get +2 sov bonus and u want to run both EoV/Funnel essence there are no points to even pick that... and they still compete with other tactics.
What i consider a significant buff is the 35% heal increase tactic. It seems like AM/Shammies want to be kept as those indepedent strong burst healers - that fits this kind of playstyle nicely

On live Focused Mind prevented Stun. So you could insta rez without the 3s stun

[JohnnyWayne]

It does here too, at least it used to before the rework (Its been a bit wonky lately, especially against snares). But insta res is not a stun in the traditional sense, so it still stuns you.

[Nameless]

On live while tou got FM, insta ress didnt stun you. Last ive cheched on ror it does stunn you. For me that is another layer of combat depth removed but whatever

[Kloaner]

- Morale pumps (AM being better since it triggers on EoV side note same with PIO FotG)

right, but I'm surprised that EoV still counts as a direct Heal

[Ysaran]

It shouldn't count anymore. Anyone can prove that it still works?

[Bozzax]

You guys miss the point 100%

1. Mechanics is bugged (most never noticed)I I believe it it’s related to adjusting mech points to the client side with casts that have shortened cast time (2-2,5s) (could be reordering or a race condition. Point is ability queue and this perceived bug can give you 2 damage casts or heal casts with
1 resource (either) on reduced cast time)

2. Shmy PIO heal on FotG (desc says mork tree) imho description should be fixed not nerf PIO, Am 25% more heal on damage is better regardless

3. Am morale pump on crit same (I must admit I am not 100% sure but more like I believe it is so myself after using it a few nights with EOV). The fact that is on heal makes it better anyway combined with requiring only one tactic and being passive

4. Shmy int steal stacks with potions which I think should be left as is bc AM is stronger anyway and has a strike through tactic.

Above all am/ shmy mechanic is the hardest in game and if you ignore it is ok as well I really like this and continuously gets out healed by lesser effort players so it is one the few things to figure out outside of getting a choppa to be more effective not sitting in red all the time

Am also is the stronger class of the two… most will never agree and I accept that. Regardless both aren’t top in any context really.