motivation killer coppa pull and dps shamie ... ? overtuned?

[Rewarc]

You don't hit anyone for 4k after mitigation without some damage increase buff e.g. near your warcamp, so 2k guard damage is not to be seen.
Like everything you mention about guard is wrong and not how it works.
Let's imagine for a second that you indeed deal so much damage, then...
" If I hit a sorc for 4k I should hit a sorc after guard for 2k and the 2k damage should be hitting the tank 1 to 1 unless your block or parry the guard damage. "
...is exactly how guard works.
The perceived higher damage reduction you notice has other reasons.
The damage difference between a critical hit and a non-crit is huge for sorc/be due to their high crit dmg bonus. It seems you compare a crit with a non-crit after guard. Absorb on your target further reduces the damage and removes the chance to critical hit.

Did you even read what I was talking about? It's an example.. Now you talking about crits... OBVIOUSLY crits make a huge diffrence wtf I wasn't even talking about that..

Idk why but I'll try one more time: Take 4k damage right? Non crit right? Those 4k damage hit a non guarded target for shocking 4k damage (Still an example btw dont get it twisted). NOW imagine if I hit a guarded target. Those 4k NON CRIT SAME DAMAGE NOTHING ELSE would not equal into 2k damage for the tank and 2k damage for the dps. It gets mitigated and than split between the tank and dps. Do you understand that? Before guard damage is applied its gets mitigated by defensive stats! Block and parry can mitigate 100% of the damage.. Do you understand that? Guard does not just split the damage as explain in the tooltip it gets further reduced by the stats of your tank.

[Rewarc]

Kill condition? You mean the 3 seconds I have if I punt the tank away? The 4 second stun I can use every 40 seconds on the enemy healer? Like what kill condition are we talking about in a 6v6 scenario with two 2/2/2 premade groups? The same applies for warband fights.. You know why everyone complains about slayer? Because after nerfing morals its the only class in the game that has consistent undefendable damage! Slayer is a walking moral dumb without actually using morals if that makes sense.

Anyway's long story short what you said makes no sense and honestly its makes you look kind off stupid because there is no suggestions on how to improve those "kill conditions". You comment adds nothing to this debate besides an empty argument you didn't even back up with an explanation on how to improve!

So how can you explain that some teams can make a lot of kills in 6v6, through guard or by using KD/punt combo ? If what you said is the truth, it should not be possible, isn't it ?
And it is not like there is other composition (for example 1/3/2) that can punt the target instead of the tank to get the frag. Of course, guard is a strong skill, but it has its limits (range, 1.5 sc GCD swap, ...).

I appreciate the try but I was again not talking about special scenarios I was talking about what happens about 90% of the time in the game.

[Asderas27]

ok andy calm down.

[CyunUnderis]

I appreciate the try but I was again not talking about special scenarios I was talking about what happens about 90% of the time in the game.

Maybe I miss the game mode you are talking about, but this does not change my words and this remark applies to any type of game mode. Successful warband leaders ask for an assist on a target in the blob, with debuff armor, debuff heal, a KD and a punt. Guard can be countered by a punt on the main tank, on the target, by a parry/block debuff on the main tank or by heavy AoE drops on the target and his tank.

So I don't understand your point.

[Emissary]

It's sad I love this game but everything I explained makes the game almost unplayable for me. It's just not fun to hit someone you know you can't kill anyways in the next 20 mins unless the enemy healer falls asleep or the tank becomes bored standing in one place..

So you are saying you feel like a tank hitting anything in this game? Maybe I'll kill it in 20 minutes or maybe I won't.

You ever play a tank, really play one?

You ever heal a tank?

I can assure you a red slayer can slaughter a tank through guard damage. Nothing like melting to a mob beating on an enraged slayer your guarding I assure you. Look at combat logs and see how many times a tank dies to guard damage.

[BoriqOne]

EXTERMINATE ALL PULLS FROM GAME ! prob solved ! it is messed up to have one side pulls be 1000% better and effective than the other sides, so get rid of them all, the game will continue to do well if not better. there i fix'd it. no thanks needed... free consultation and advice, your welcome !

[Alubert]

Agree, same with rampage. Ban rampage for both side.

[flux]

Remove all pulls, make dmg break stealth, remove rampage, mirror ID and remove apothecary and all vendor pots. That will make many buffs synergize and redundant skills used again.

[KingKong007]

Best thread Eva!! Don't stop...order tears and destro popcorn! Stop nerfing the game and buff all! Don't steal our abilities please add to them all

[Repulsion]

Remove all pulls, remove rampage, mirror ID and remove apothecary and all vendor pots. That will make many buffs synergize and redundant skills used again.

This - and especially the part in bold - 100% unironically. Ok, maybe not remove Mara/WL pull but rework it so it's not rage inducingly cheesy and not useless at the sametime. Potting, especially after the GCD change makes for an even slower game where gear is even more of a deciding factor than player input; the amount of error pots and high armor from sov buys you is a bit ridiculous at this point, especially with the lower overall burst.