Amount of parry

[Smellybelly]

I understand what you are tryng to say but you are confuse

A-wep skill matter when it cames to guard parry, yes it does like same goes for block rate from shield so in this field

Block rate = wep skill

So there is no wep skill unbalance considering how also block or avoidance on block are rewarded to tanks via core skills or builds. Exemple free kobs shield rush + block rate from shield = 15-20% to say.

B- you are confuse regarding higher parry be better than block + parry.
Exemple throw 2 dices 1 is block the other is parry.
One you pass it with 5+ the other one with 2+

If you had only the 2+ you would have 1/6 chance to fail, if you add the 5+ for that 1 you divide 1 by 3 (5+ over. 6 faces dices). Aka now you chance to fail are 0.6 /6

S+b can have either same or better avoidance than 2h

Also the 5+ dice also apply to dodge and disrupt. For your own personal defense (and parry).

If you are trying to talk to Hogun then complicated formulas is not the way to go x)

[hogun]

I understand what you are tryng to say but you are confuse

A-wep skill matter when it cames to guard parry, yes it does like same goes for block rate from shield so in this field

Block rate = wep skill

So there is no wep skill unbalance considering how also block or avoidance on block are rewarded to tanks via core skills or builds. Exemple free kobs shield rush + block rate from shield = 15-20% to say.

B- you are confuse regarding higher parry be better than block + parry.
Exemple throw 2 dices 1 is block the other is parry.
One you pass it with 5+ the other one with 2+

If you had only the 2+ you would have 1/6 chance to fail, if you add the 5+ for reroll that 1 you divide 1 by 3 (5+ over. 6 faces dices 1/3 chance of success). Aka now you chance to fail are 0.6 /6

S+b can have either same or better avoidance than 2h

Also the 5+ dice also apply to dodge and disrupt. For your own personal defense (and parry). This is why all tanks are either block or parry based at least and not disrupt based or dodge for exemple.
Its a system that work.

I'm not confused I'm calculating they're just probabilities, which in the end can only reduce to one %, which I did.

it's quite complicated for some, but in fact it's very simple.
Maybe my English, is completely rotten, so it becomes difficult to understand.

if you are attacked by 100 attacks, and you have 40% blocking only 60 attacks will hit you.
But you can still have the chance to parry the attacks that have passed your block...

if you have 30% of parry, out of the 60 attacks that have passed your block you will be able to parry 30%... so only 42 attacks will hit you.

in conclusion on the 100 attacks if 42 hits you have a total of 58% defense. ( and not 40% + 30% which would make 70%)

[Aurandilaz]

I really do not understand what is purpose of this thread....

First, target has defence check against coming dmg - either Parry Dodge or Disrupt
then Guard ally, gets damage via Guard
first is Block check
then comes Parry check

combining both Block+Parry as way of mitigating Guard dmg is very vital in keeping tank alive. With only Parry guard dmg, even if your parry is +70-90, the tank will melt from both enemy pressure and Guard pressure combined - this is why 2hander tanks are not viable in organized warbands (pugs can do whatever they want I guess).

Hogun, if you are somehow trying to prove that Parry is better than combination of Block+Parry double check, then you just happen to be wrong this time.

[Telen]

I really do not understand what is purpose of this thread....

First, target has defence check against coming dmg - either Parry Dodge or Disrupt
then Guard ally, gets damage via Guard
first is Block check
then comes Parry check

combining both Block+Parry as way of mitigating Guard dmg is very vital in keeping tank alive. With only Parry guard dmg, even if your parry is +70-90, the tank will melt from both enemy pressure and Guard pressure combined - this is why 2hander tanks are not viable in organized warbands (pugs can do whatever they want I guess).

Hogun, if you are somehow trying to prove that Parry is better than combination of Block+Parry double check, then you just happen to be wrong this time.

Hes saying the difference isnt enough to justify it in smallscale. Which is what the guard change is aimed at.

[hogun]

I really do not understand what is purpose of this thread....

First, target has defence check against coming dmg - either Parry Dodge or Disrupt
then Guard ally, gets damage via Guard
first is Block check
then comes Parry check

combining both Block+Parry as way of mitigating Guard dmg is very vital in keeping tank alive. With only Parry guard dmg, even if your parry is +70-90, the tank will melt from both enemy pressure and Guard pressure combined - this is why 2hander tanks are not viable in organized warbands (pugs can do whatever they want I guess).

Hogun, if you are somehow trying to prove that Parry is better than combination of Block+Parry double check, then you just happen to be wrong this time.

pity its mathématique about domage guard , not direct dommage

[Aurandilaz]

Hes saying the difference isnt enough to justify it in smallscale. Which is what the guard change is aimed at.

Well, in smallscale your party most likely is not going to get dmg pressure from whole enemy warband AoE melt nor 2 of them. So maybe just stacking high Parry is "good enuf" to live - but combination of high Block and good amount of Parry is still way superior if your intention is to maximize how much pressure a tank can handle before melting.
However, another thing is, so much of tank utility was stripped from being generally available into just being available when using 2hander - which kinda pushed people away from trying SnB in smallscale when so many juicy abilities ended up being locked behind 2h requirement.
Offensive SnB spec works in some cases - but for so many classes certain smallscale key abilities require 2hander use.

Which is why the latest changes seem so absurdly alien to many of the players I guess.

[Telen]

Well, in smallscale your party most likely is not going to get dmg pressure from whole enemy warband AoE melt nor 2 of them. So maybe just stacking high Parry is "good enuf" to live - but combination of high Block and good amount of Parry is still way superior if your intention is to maximize how much pressure a tank can handle before melting.
However, another thing is, so much of tank utility was stripped from being generally available into just being available when using 2hander - which kinda pushed people away from trying SnB in smallscale when so many juicy abilities ended up being locked behind 2h requirement.
Offensive SnB spec works in some cases - but for so many classes certain smallscale key abilities require 2hander use.

Which is why the latest changes seem so absurdly alien to many of the players I guess.

I think the issue is that much of the game is designed around additive stats and soft and hard caps. Where as avoidance is multiplicative percentages which reduces the effectiveness of block in regards to guard damage. In warbands its ok because block has the benefit of that multiplicative percentage being effective for all damage types.

Its seems a lifetime ago and Ive played so many mmos since but could guard damage be parried on live?

[hogun]

Its seems a lifetime ago and Ive played so many mmos since but could guard damage be parried on live?

I don't think so.

[Ramasee]

You guys are also forgetting the parry bonuses from weapon skill, the block bonuses from shield rating, the respective realized avoidance caps to both block and parry. Also forgetting that going from 50% avoidance to 65% avoidance isn't 15% less damage taken.

Also to answer your question, yes guard damage could be parried on live.

[Tesq]

I understand what you are tryng to say but you are confuse

A-wep skill matter when it cames to guard parry, yes it does like same goes for block rate from shield so in this field

Block rate = wep skill

So there is no wep skill unbalance considering how also block or avoidance on block are rewarded to tanks via core skills or builds. Exemple free kobs shield rush + block rate from shield = 15-20% to say.

B- you are confuse regarding higher parry be better than block + parry.
Exemple throw 2 dices 1 is block the other is parry.
One you pass it with 5+ the other one with 2+

If you had only the 2+ you would have 1/6 chance to fail, if you add the 5+ for reroll that 1 you divide 1 by 3 (5+ over. 6 faces dices 1/3 chance of success). Aka now you chance to fail are 0.6 /6

S+b can have either same or better avoidance than 2h

Also the 5+ dice also apply to dodge and disrupt. For your own personal defense (and parry). This is why all tanks are either block or parry based at least and not disrupt based or dodge for exemple.
Its a system that work.

I'm not confused I'm calculating they're just probabilities, which in the end can only reduce to one %, which I did.

it's quite complicated for some, but in fact it's very simple.
Maybe my English, is completely rotten, so it becomes difficult to understand.

if you are attacked by 100 attacks, and you have 40% blocking only 60 attacks will hit you.
But you can still have the chance to parry the attacks that have passed your block...

if you have 30% of parry, out of the 60 attacks that have passed your block you will be able to parry 30%... so only 42 attacks will hit you.

in conclusion on the 100 attacks if 42 hits you have a total of 58% defense. ( and not 40% + 30% which would make 70%)

Yes and no, torque changed how that roll work is not a roll in that sense its a bit more complicated also block work also with dodge and disrupt even if it have nothing to do with guard you should multiply x3 the difference of 15% for exemple.