sc pug is it a trap for noob player ?

[Yaliskah]

Well the system isn't perfect ofc, but everytime i read this kind of complaints ( no offense) it seems "premades" are ALWAYS in the opposite side.

So unless we find a better solution to fix this and avoid this kind of abuse it will be like this. We can't put a GM behind each player H24.

Keep in mind pointing an issue and design a clever solution are 2 different things. If not, just give the code to update, it will be done in the next patchnote .

Sorry.

[peterthepan3]

it seems to me that some players do not imagine that it is possible to play casual without optimization ... it's sad. I think that the sc pug should be a sc preserved for casual / pug / solo and it may give envy to novice players to stay on the server. because I imagine that this farmed in sc must not give you want to stay!

the only thing such a sc encourages novice players to do is to play suboptimally with no desire of improving or playing with other people - but that's a topic for another time.

ot: if you are seriously getting manhandled by a duo when you have 11 people you can coordinate with, what can one honestly infer other than that being a l2p issue ?

what do you mean by opposite side yaliskah (bit confused)

[Pacso]

Having duos dominate pug scs doesn't tell you that the system is bonkers or exploitable, but that the average pug is entirely brainafk ~ in other words: that pugs can't even muster enough impromptu coordination to match 1/3 of a group; no assist, no guard, no CC, plenty of overextending instead, yadayada.

pretty much what I take from it.

premades too hard! gave them a pug sc
now it's duos are too hard! so let's remove duos

at what point will we draw the line? shall we also make a pug sc exempt from specific players, just to further appease ?

The problem is not the "duo" itself. The problem is when 3 duos from the same guild using the same discord queuing for the pug sc only.
You can say there are only three duos, but i say its a preamde.

[peterthepan3]

we relying on your word here, or do we have empirical proof (for some reason, the latter always seems to be lacking when these complaints arise).
btw I agree that one or two trash premades are doing this, but unfortunately have no evidence atm.

[Darosh]

it seems to me that some players do not imagine that it is possible to play casual without optimization ...

Most duos do not even voice chat, let alone run specific specs ~ they assist and support each other, and more importantly even other players in the respective SCs.
Players participating in duos and groups could solo queue and still skew the SCs in their realms favor - with ease -, as they are used to properly assist off other DPS, float guard, anticipate and coordinate bursts, mind their positioning and don't overextend ~ just like they would if they played in a duo or group.

Some of the duos some of you have in mind, I can gurantee it, aren't even actual duos... but are made up of the kind of players described above, forming the duos impromptu (as one would expect and hope for); people that simply make the bare minimum effort to not be just an 'extra' staring in a movie or a mere viewer thereof ~ to not be easily replacable with a bot.

[oioigitface]

Is that hard to find 1 (one, uno, un, einz) other player to duo with in the pug sc? I really don't see a issue.

[hogun]

the only thing such a sc encourages novice players to do is to play suboptimally with no desire of improving or playing with other people - but that's a topic for another time.

ot: if you are seriously getting manhandled by a duo when you have 11 people you can coordinate with, what can one honestly infer other than that being a l2p issue ?

your way of defending optimization in the SC pug says a lot about your practice!

Can you imagine that players just want to play their character the way they want? whether it's good or bad from your point of view?
to play for fun without ambition of optimization or result.

Finally, how many player with no heal ( lvl 32+ )can die against a duo BG / DKdps or CHosen / DKdps?

[Darosh]

the only thing such a sc encourages novice players to do is to play suboptimally with no desire of improving or playing with other people - but that's a topic for another time.

ot: if you are seriously getting manhandled by a duo when you have 11 people you can coordinate with, what can one honestly infer other than that being a l2p issue ?

your way of defending optimization in the SC pug says a lot about your practice!

Can you imagine that players just want to play their character the way they want? whether it's good or bad from your point of view?
to play for fun without ambition of optimization or result.

Finally, a player with no heal can die against a duo BG / DKdps or CHosen / DKdps?

Plain reliability >>> gear, spec, communicational optimization.

I mean, where do you draw the line? What are the indicators and criteria by which you would call out a duo?

Is it the two DPS that manage to assist off each other?
Is it the tank and the DPS that manage to stick to each other?
Is it the tank or the DPS that consistently and continously rush back to peel for a "specific" healer (they deem reliable), or to the only healer there is?
Is it the tank that slaps snare onto incoming MDPS that couldn't telegraph it more obviously that they are charging for a "specific" RDPS/Healer, over and over?
Is it the DPS that knows when to rush out of the combat so a(/"his") tank can float his guard properly?
Is it the RDPS that DOES NOT gift immunities so a(/"his") tank can properly use his CC?
Is it the healer that uses some of his CC to open burst opportunities for a DPS, or to help a "specific" RDPS to kite?

It speaks volumes one can even differentiate between players in that regard, duos shouldn't be nearly as easy to spot as they are ~ they quite literally should be indistinguishable from the players around them.

E: Added some emphasis...

[hogun]

I understand, but in general, it seems to me, duo make classes that do not complete classes that will complement others. maybe the solution for this SC only course not to allow the duo but only a solo tag.

a solution SC RR 39 or lvl 39 max

[Aurandilaz]

Havent bothered to play scs in ages, but few months ago I remember duoing on my WE with a Blorc from same guild. Got decent kills, even though my WE keeps exploding ez when no dedicated healer around. Got accused of being a premade.
Then the screeching from enemies got worse when 2 other guildies decided to form their own duo as another dps+tank combo. We sometimes ended in same sc, sometimes not. No one cared if we ended in different scs, but as soon as we got ""lucky"" and had 2 dps+tank duos from same guild in the sc, the enemy started raging and accusing us of cheating and exploiting and threatening reports, even if we did our best to stay away from each other and sometimes just split over the map in order to calm the screaming down...

It's just too troublesome. Easiest would be ofc just to leave guild and play as "guildless", but it gets too tiresome to have enemies with bad setup scream and throw hissyfits as soon as they see that other side has 1 or 2 duos in same sc.