ORVR Purple bags

[bloodi]

Where's the constructive criticism?

RNG sucks. White bags for tryharding sucks (because RNG). Gear > FUN. Do more get more doesn't matter (because people abused multi-char RvR stacking).

White bags for everyone wasn't intended, but that's what happened. The intent was a normal rate of bags where most of the time you get NOTHING, but it didn't work. So we let white bags happen.

No, its not Gear > FUN, this is one of the issues here, you take anything that goes against your ideas as either malicious or with an agenda, you somehow cannot in this world concieve that being against the current system can come from someone who doesnt follow that ideal, is not about Gear being the objective above fun, is about how your current system is.

Unless you get this concept of "everyone who is not with me is against me" and stop putting labels on them, we cant have a conversation or a discussion and the issue here lays on you, not the playerbase.

What people wants is to be rewarded and no, a white bag with a medallion in it is not a reward for 6 hours of RvR, you give them that, they are going to go find a way for it to not happen again, they asked you for one, you refused to give it, so now they are gaming your system, this is an issue you and only you created.

And again, is not about Gear being the end of it all but its still a major reason for a lot of people to play, thats all, there is nothing more to it than that.

You're defending people that brought as many characters as possible into RvR for minimal contribution to get RNG rolls. I don't feel bad at all if that's what you get snark for. It is kind of sad behavior, you need gear so bad you're basically abusing an exploit so get rolls on everything when you don't do anything.

We have a recurring theme that comes up. If you're getting something for doing (basically) nothing, that's going to be fixed. Don't be shocked.

No, i am not defending them, i am pointing out how hypocrital is to nurture such people then claim betrayal when you found out they exist.

Again, you were given plenty of feedback on the matter, they told you repeteadly that contribution didnt matter at all, it was a pure RNG system where getting more tickets was incredibly more profitable than playing the god damn game.

And thats by design, you designed it that way, so people didnt get your precious gear in a timely manner and had to suffer through RNG, now when they act accordingly and adapt to such system, you denounce them. Come on.

We've already heard people don't like RNG. We're very aware, mucho. Why is anyone surprised that it's still here? That's the system that we want in place. It serves a function of slowing down BIS gear accumulation. It serves a function of anticipation, relief, exhilaration, etc. It's one of the few places where RNG is hard, but it's also the main draw of the game (RVR).

You're fighting battles that have already been lost, we're not going that direction for certain gear accumulation menthods. Transparency is another issue, it turns what should be "doing stuff" in RvR into a checklist, where do A > B > C > D then farm enemies until the zone flips. We don't want to have a checklist. We DO want to see people hard-stuck in farming players getting less gear on the flip, and players that actually do stuff (aside from solely farming players) feeling more like once they break through RNG they get gear faster than others.
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Yeah, you heard it, you ignored it and then cry when your playerbase plays according to it. Thats why i say that you reap what you sow.

And people is surprised because every other dev in the world learned the lesson of how shitty RNG based systems are, hell, Mythic learned that on live and thats why we have tokens but somehow everyone else is wrong and you really believe that getting **** by it, its "the main draw of the game".

Sure, its not like half the people on it they are there just because its the only way to get their gear so they can actually have fun.

[Fallenkezef]

A token system would solve these issues if the bis gear costs are sufficiently high.

Ok, reading through there is allot if ingratitude.

Devs have given us gunbad, people whine that the gear is not good enough.

Devs working on CH22 pq's and I've seen posts that the gear is not good enough.

My issues are not that gear is easy/hard but the randomn nature of it but the devs seem to be set on tweaking that so all good.

I know the devs are dead set against a token system but it is tried and tested in other mmo's and works.

Other options include keep lords dropping loot, npcs on bo's dropping loot etc

[Wam]

That's a shame if you feel that way Hargrim, I can see both sides are passionate about the project, both players and devs invest time...

I for one always like your posting even if i don't always agree with everything, fact of life its impossible to agree with anyone 100% of the time

There is just seems to be a breakdown/disconect in communication and alot of salt on the forums (valid or not)... written text can be easy to misinterpret and things might come across more aggressive than originally intended and people's frustrations boil over and clash heads... and no positive outcome

People sometimes just need to take a step back, breathe... chill out and talk in constructive manner to be honest... if one of most active dev's stops posting then breakdown in communication will just be worse and so will people's apparent frustrations ...
I know the goal posts shifted when the system changed and don't try hard the campaign anymore... effort and reward is not Equal like it use to be rewarded for effort and being high killer... (i already have full on main so it effects me less personally)

On destro side generally TUP or Phalanx, who would have biggest wb/setup at the time and start earlier on the zone was almost a lock for bags because they did the most killing... pugs would only get a look in if they was in a open zone for multiple hours before a organised warband showed up... both systems have flaws nothing is perfect... but atleast people who contributed got rewarded more fairly (besides the guy with 750 contribution and rolled a 2 RIP to you sir)

now you could fight hard many hours, be top kills it don't matter you are almost guarenteed to get a white bag (if any, sometimes people have bugged out and 0 contribution despite being there and this is not via temp disable times) and some lowbie or even a rank 40 could show up last minute... get a kill or die once and win a gold... that creates a massive disparity in the new system which the old system didn't have and that creates frustration because its more RNG

I know you dev's love the RNG... I feel the players are not as big a fan of it, it is the way it is... somewhere in the middle where it's more fair in my opinion is good for server health... or you will see players do less for more... Im not sure what dev's collective vision of ORVR is or how the game should be played... however I know some players just get burnt out from RNG because some people are lucky (which is great) but some players are super unlucky (hello dupe city)

I remember having to farm ruin pq for some guildie before... he was missing last piece... took 11+ attempts... another guy I farmed ruin he got it 5/5 no dupes... ruin is fine its farmable (also token system) players can do something in their own power to acheive character progression with... but with blue bags (alot harder to acquire especially in current system... now it really is a lottery) you can rinse repeat farm... so you can understand why some players who get dupes get a bit frustrated because their character progression is hindered by invisible barrier/pure RNG... and its out of their hands.

Dev's do a good job fixing things, sometimes efforts might feel under appreciated... passions rise and sometimes things get a little too heated in wrong way but everyone here would want project to suceed... players are here to have fun, but are also a resource that could be used more in my opinion... if you want certain things tested more communicate desires/intent and we can provide even better feedback than the current status quo.

[Darosh]

It might sound like lunacy, but in regards to RNG or other topics that are deadset on... embrace it, throw together a Raidboss called 'RNGesus McFucksYouOverSideways' and have the players vent their frustration - humor is gold, in any situation.
A meme could arise from the ashes to entertain us for years to come, provided the communal breakdown is prevented.
Escalating it here serves no purpose but to treat symptoms of a bigger issue, an open, agreed-upon free-for-all might be reasonable and ultimately reconciling; most of the hard feelings in this thread stem from what Wam has alluded to: misinterpretation.

Abbd.:
Forum regulars might be a small, all the more vocal minority of the overall community, but things tend to seep through the cracks and into said overall community. Butterflies, stones falling into water, yadayada.
Not to mention that the forums are publicly accessible and might portray something that either is not accurate or twisted in a way ~ clearing stuff up doesn't hurt.


E: Added an important set of words.

[Aurandilaz]

You're defending people that brought as many characters as possible into RvR for minimal contribution to get RNG rolls. I don't feel bad at all if that's what you get snark for. It is kind of sad behavior, you need gear so bad you're basically abusing an exploit so get rolls on everything when you don't do anything.

We have a recurring theme that comes up. If you're getting something for doing (basically) nothing, that's going to be fixed. Don't be shocked.

I knew this was possible for months, yet didn't particularly feel even motivated to do so. Then one weekend 2-3 weeks ago, I decided to hop over 4-5 alts in two zones, and afterwards wrote in RoR discord what I was doing was working, as I was indeed getting easily more bags than if I had just played one char for 2 bags from 2 zones, I had instead gained 8-10 bags.
This report from me was met with claims from staff that I was exploiting, and one week later eventually it was fixed so that now you can only get bags on one char per zone.

Now I have stated that currently it is still a perfectly viable tactic to play for 15 mins, do 3-5 kills and then log off and hope your sides loses, as a way to minmax time spent chasing after RNGesus Mystery Bags.

Last week my BW won Gold from being in zone for 20 mins and doing 3 kills and about 300-500 renown contributed. Last night my Sorc was in zone for 3,5 hours, earned 63000 renown and won another white bag.

I am hoping that all the feedback I give eventually leads to a better bag system, even if it means that I get accused of "exploiting" or "gaming the system".

[wargrimnir]

There really isn't much point to this dragging out then.

RNG isn't going anywhere. Contribution system is a work in progress until we feel it's right.