Increase Winner AND Loser Emblems from Isha/EC SC

[GodlessCrom]

WoW took away pvp gear rewards this expac and pvp participation hit an all time low even though objectively more comps are viable than in last expac).

Well, as someone who last played in wotlk, i didnt hear anything but dreadful thigns about how it progressed since then so i am not entirely sure that is the sole thing to blame for that.

Fair point but the I think its telling that in an expac that received near universal acclaim compared to the two preceding it, pvp has seen its lowest player participation ever even though morr comps (and more classes) are viable than in the last three expacs (wotlk last patch had similar diversity of spec).

Anyways, RoR is not WoW and all that. But player rewards, in an MMORPG at least, matter a lot. I think you made a good point about it being fun though. Or rather, not fun. We have such a small community that, particularly in NA times, the odds of there being more than 1-2 premades that can actually compete with each other is low. And farming crappy premades, let alone being the crappy premade, is anti fun.

[peterthepan3]

You need to drop this fantasy that you can make everyone adopt YOUR ideal of how to play this game.

Actually I think I speak on behalf of a great many people, but np. Keep hitting me with those negative vibes.

(truth be told, I thought you'd be all for measures to tackle pug farming)

Don't mistake my meaning. I know you are passionate about teamplay and organised groups but I have played enough mmo's to know that literaly NOTHING works to create it.

Carrot or stick, it always fails because each individual has to evolve towards it.

Any idiot can see that organisef play is inherently better, you don't need rewards to make that point. A straw is weak, a bundle unbreakable.

Thing is it takes time and an individual journey to go from solo loner to team playet and that will happen if you reward it or not.

But the majority never make that step, in any game.

Good points, though I don't pretend to try and tackle a more existential issue that plagues players in MMOs in general; I don't envy any man that would =P

Organised play is better, but the issue that I was bringing up, in regards to scenarios, is why bother even attempting to group up and explore 'teamplay and organised' play when one can get the same bang for less and quicker buck going solo, etc.

For what it's worth, lest it seem that I come across demanding, I'm happy to stream/record some footage highlighting the issues I'm talking about.

[oaliaen]

Spoiler:

so...6 more emblems to order and 4 to destro??


NO SIR

What did this add to the discussion? Warning issued for trolling - Penril

[bloodi]

why bother even attempting to group up and explore 'teamplay and organised' play when one can get the same bang for less and quicker buck going solo, etc.

Dont worry because you dont, at all.

Some "pugmades" may be slower because between every sc one has to go feed his dogs girlfriend, next one one guy needs to pee and takes 25 minutes, you are finding a tank for 40 minutes and then the other has to leave and so on and so forth.

But a 6 man that queues within a reasonable time after the last sc will get a rate of medallions/emblems a pug can only dream of, i dont know who could argue otherwise.

[Manatikik]

Spoiler:

@warg - So let me see if I understand this correctly. The dev team is unwilling to test changes that are (to my knowledge) fast/non-time consuming and easy to implement on an alpha server that would benefit group play (and building communities such as regular groups and guilds would translate to higher player retention rate over benefiting PUG playerbase for the obvious psycho/socio attributes that have been studied and published) due to the fact that a minority of the overall playerbase might find a suitable way to exploit this? And because SC's are mini-games?

@Yali - In regards to you theory of evolution of freebies -> dead server: so far 80-90% of the people I know who have left the server left not because things are too grindy/too hard to attain but because of the way the staff handles changes; not the changes perse themselves but the way certain staff members handle the changes and attitude towards the playerbase. Not a single one has said that they wish they got free BiS (and everyone was super happy with the new loot roll system being less of a crap shoot on Conq) and RR80 but were offended that the staff was making undocumented changes and then treating everyone like terrorist suspects.

I was going to respond to this, but it's mostly just a lot of sniping and jabs at the staff here. You get a warning instead.

[Fallenkezef]

Actually I think I speak on behalf of a great many people, but np. Keep hitting me with those negative vibes.

(truth be told, I thought you'd be all for measures to tackle pug farming)

Don't mistake my meaning. I know you are passionate about teamplay and organised groups but I have played enough mmo's to know that literaly NOTHING works to create it.

Carrot or stick, it always fails because each individual has to evolve towards it.

Any idiot can see that organisef play is inherently better, you don't need rewards to make that point. A straw is weak, a bundle unbreakable.

Thing is it takes time and an individual journey to go from solo loner to team playet and that will happen if you reward it or not.

But the majority never make that step, in any game.

Good points, though I don't pretend to try and tackle a more existential issue that plagues players in MMOs in general; I don't envy any man that would =P

Organised play is better, but the issue that I was bringing up, in regards to scenarios, is why bother even attempting to group up and explore 'teamplay and organised' play when one can get the same bang for less and quicker buck going solo, etc.

That's the thing, you could create an SC that literaly doubles the exp/renown if you enter as a premade, shower premades with emblems and you'll still won't see any major increase in the number of premades. A significant number of premades exist to farm pugs for easy wins because they have no interest in a fair fight.

You are looking at this the wrong way.

REMOVE rewards for premades, create an SC that has NO rewards, ZERO return for playing it. I guarantee the majority of puggers who are mostly playing for easy farming of renown will not play it and the premades created to hunt puggers will ignore it just as they ignore the current premade SC.

However you'll see a gradual increase in the premades that share your mindset, who play just for the challenge of 6v6.

[peterthepan3]

The idea is luring said premades away from their pug farming (thus benefiting said pugs) in the hopes that they'll engage with other premades, better themselves, and increase group v group action that the game desperately needs.

[NoRKaLKiLLa]

I agree with this change wholeheartedly- however I'm a cosmetic queen and believe that the premade vs premade SC should not only reward more emblems for participating and winning in order to encourage more competitive group play, but also reward over time cosmetic items only attainable through this SC. They need not have any added stat bonus but would instantly make a character recognizable as having won x amount of premade vs premade scenarios.

[rmpl]

That's the thing, you could create an SC that literaly doubles the exp/renown if you enter as a premade, shower premades with emblems and you'll still won't see any major increase in the number of premades.

How do you know that?

[Elemint]

It's a lost cause I'm afraid.

I thought it was the rewards, it's not the common rewards. It's status rewards, a publicly displayed number (so we can know that we are better than the peons with a smaller number and strive to have the highest number), a coolest possible mount etc. As is, fighting so all 3 groups know how they stack up is cool and all, but there is no competition if nobody cares. If anyone was thinking that this is incredibly vain, please, spare us the eyeroll and don't point it out. It's just basic sociology.

It's the matchmaking, matchmaker rating. Good groups don't bang with bad players, and by now everyone knows who the good and the bad players are. If one was to make a new group that would want to start competing, one would be relentlessly pummeled by the existing and experienced groups until one gave up. If one was to join an existing group but wasn't already good, one would be kicked after 2 scs and stonewalled forever after. The only person who made an attempt at upping the competition is Peter, one player at a time. Now Peter might not be the ideal mentor, and i might not like him much, but i respect him for trying. If there isn't a way for players to be pitted against their equals, there isn't competition, there is no fun.

Playing sixes has definitely been the most fun part of this game for me, and near my end the only fun part of the game. I would just log in to play with my friends and log out when playing the game becomes so boring not even the guild banter can keep me on.

I highly doubt devs would actually consider implementing exclusive rewards and matchmaking, and i feel this game can never as competitive as you dream it to be without them. I agree with the suggestion, tho. It might just make people care more, and that would make more people care more.