[WL] Best 1v1 build

[th3gatekeeper]

I thought the WL 1v1 build was basically just releasing the pet on the enemy and running away.

Close. You pop RD and sprint away while the pet attacks. The you resummon pet while running, wait till your enemy is getting heavily dotted up by BW and AMs then you pounce, KD, fetch and once dead, you can taunt via a /laugh. Then don't forget to PM the guy telling him how scrub he is and how 1337 you are!

(Pro Tip: During Keep Defense send your pet on the enemy Ram. Resummon once dead. Rinse/repeat.)

WL: The only MDPS that is also a RDPS

[GodlessCrom]

I feel like White Lion is becoming the ret paladin (circa Wrath of the Lich King) of Warhammer. "Plate, bubble, AND heals?!" becomes "pet, burst, AND pounce?!" :p

Gotta say, does feel good being able to kill all the shamans though. Well, all the shamans except Morfee

[Spacecraft]

Only reason you see lots of wl is because of lol shammys. You need a wb to take done a good one. So if des is whiny you kinda brought it on yourself.

[gandresch]

It is always the same destro players who bring this up. Even on things that got changed/nerfed secretly.
Cant wait that the WL gets through balances to Devs and this will stop. They mostly cry because of getting killed solo.
I hope those ppl will stop complaining than.

Edit: and nothing will change because the WL is not OP in 6v6 or 24v24.
And if you look at solo the shaman, SH or mdps dok , marauder who uses monstro stance or any tank is stronger.

I dont see WBs of WL but WBs full of SH or SHM rocking.

[GodlessCrom]

I see WL as the most common mdps on order now, but that's mirrored by Marauder on destro, so meh. I think it's clear why WL are so popular/hated: they're basically the only mdps who can solo queue and have fun. With Pounce, Fetch, and your pet, you can always do something, unlike other mdps who will melt the instant they expose themselves without guard/heals. So, if you're a PUG and wanna play melee, you're either gonna be a tank or a White Lion. Witch Elves/Witch Hunters can solo roam in orvr, but WL excel there too, and in SCs the WE/WH are less likely to find solitary prey and so they suffer the same as other mdps (perhaps moreso, because they lack Charge and have light armor rather than medium).

I don't think they are OP, just good at PUGing and solo roaming. Though, they can certainly be a pain to guard, bounding all over the place as they do, and me with my stubby dorf legs trying to play catch up lol.

[gandresch]

And because he is good for solo pugging and roaming he should get a nerf? I dont think so.

Every shaman or sh is much better for solo roaming. Thats why you see so many. Sometimes i have the feeling 30% of des are gobbos.

[GodlessCrom]

I literally said I don't think they should be nerfed. Just offering an opinion on why they're so popular. Popular doesn't mean OP, or necessarily even good. Bloodseeker in DOTA is one of the most popular heroes, and he's typically considered garbage-tier by pro players (or at least he was when I was playing more regularly). They also synergize very well with Swordmasters, whom are the second most popular Order tank. Also, they're elves and elves are always popular in fantasy.

[gandresch]

I get your points. Would love to see statistics again to see which class is the most played one.

[th3gatekeeper]

At the end of the day, I think there is an ultimate fundamental "issue" going on. I am not trying to make a point or debate or say where I stand on these, but I will point these out as more "facts" that I see.

- Balance is built around premade vs premade (larger than 6 vs 6).

- Mara > WL in a Warband setting or even in 6v6. He has more overall tools and when supported has better sustained DPS where as if you kill a WL pet, he is not as useful.
HOWEVER

- Mara really requires a full group (heals + tank) to be more useful as WL, where as WL is the only MDPS class that can solo or PUG play and can dominate RDPS due to pounce. Doesnt REQUIRE guard to be useful, since he has the highest mobility of all MDPS classes and in many cases can ACT like RDPS due to WL pet + pounce. (Since RVR is a RDPS meta - this leads to significant advantages the WL has over every other MDPS class).

- WLs pounce breaks the normal "meta" of the game(tanks/melee frontlines, RDPS/healers in back. WL can skip the frontlines and go right to the back, which wouldnt be a problem EXCEPT they have the ability to kill unguarded squishies in just a few GCDs which forces the tanks to fall back to guard the pounced upon healers.)

- The argument that "You only see WLs because of Shaman/Squig" doesnt seem to be true IMO. Even if you removed Run Away, Wl would still be JUST as popular, if not more, because pounce would be that much better.

- The Mastery Trees of both Mara and WL are flawed in that all the "best stuff" comes from tier 2 Mastery, rather than tier 3 (armor debuff, Burst - aka Cull the Weak/Guillotine, Brutal Pounce)

- Both have good damage, CC, mobility, really lacking nothing.



Now for my opinions.
- the areas that should be addressed IMO are the Mastery Tree and the "breaking of the meta via pouncing over tank walls".

This would tone down Mara for group play, as well as WL. Which is needed IMO.

- Trying to compare WL to Mara and saying "see its fine" is stupid. Mara is OP. So all your saying is "well its not AS OP as this other OP class" - this does NOTHING to address if WL is actually OP or not. What you SHOULD be doing is comparing WL to all other MDPS classes (Slayer/CHoppa/SH/SE/Mara) of which, its the 2nd best one by a mile....

- SO what I See is: Mara needs scaled back, and WL needs scaled back to be inline with the other classes.

This can be addressed via adjusting the Mastery Trees to make it "cost" more to get the best stuff - hurting both Mara and WL at the same time - bringing them both "inline" with the other MDPS Classes.

I have made a proposal on this you can see it for yourself: viewtopic.php?f=95&t=21511

[Penril]

Why the hell are you guys talking about balance in this thread? OP asked for some 1v1 builds. That's it. If you want to whine about WL being OP, go to the balance discussions forum or make a new "WL is OP" thread somewhere else.