[Guard Mechanic] - Discussion/Changes?

[Arobain]

i've been thinking about maybe guard being different for each tank class, so for a wild example, ironbreaker keeps the current guard, since he is more of a turtle tank, kotbs gets a party wide guard that instead of 50%, 10% to all group members, and the swordmaster i dont really know, but maybe, a big resistance of 80% to a certain type of damage at one time, that the swordmaster can switch depending on the situation?

I think that would complicate things too much and greatly disturb melee dps players.

Also shake the game from its core, %10 less damage for team members or spesific resistance to a type is smth like tactics or morale abilities etc can have u definetily cannot forsake current guard for these (like BO da Greenest or sorcerer m2 wind shield thing). Those things can only be extras

i dont think it would complicate things at all, i think it would add more variety, and different ways to achieve the same thing

[Eathisword]

Guard is a cornerstone of the tank archetype and of this game in general. The only way Guard will now ever come up for discussion is if a skilled player happens to write a proposal on it.

Damn... I was about to propose something, then I changed my mind... Guard is pretty much fine and pretty much the only reason WAR/RoR has unique tanks : they are very very powerful in PvP group setup. Very few games have that rolling for them.

Furthermore, I don't think some people realize how much computation have been made so that damage balances out only with guard. Without it : everything dies in 2-3 timestamps. Tweaking guard would require a very massive overhaul of all damage/heal related calculations and base numbers. Crazy stuff.

That being said, maybe some change to main guard counters could be cool. Namely immunity timer. I believe it would make fight more action packed if immunity to punt were reduced to most tanks punt CD : 20s for single target punts, 10s for AoE punts. Small change, but it would make fights a little bit more fast paced.

[Jaycub]

It doesn't give premades any advantage over pugs: a person's refusal/inability to use a skill integral to their archetype is another issue altogether. Guard can be countered in smallscale (watch korze/simtex's streams for 6v6 and watch how their groups counter it) and in large-scale (excessive force)

Seriously baffles me why people think changes ought to be centered around people not playing the game properly.

Guard only has 1 hardcounter, that only 3 class, maybe 4 if you count IB have.

There are also countermeasures players can use to nullify this counterplay if pulled off unless it's done absolutely perfectly. First off there is detaunt, one of the reasons MDPS ruled outside the of proc meta was because they had AoE detaunts. Secondly you have morales like bellow, and ID... which only destro has access to realistically atm (balance is totally skewed towards destro because of this imo). This means, not only do you have to punt tank(s) at the same time you also have to pacify the dps to stop detaunt, pacify tanks to stop morales, same with healers as they have morales sometimes on the same level... gonna cry about destro more here and bring up Khaines withdrawal M2 on DoK which is why most people run double dok to have 4 get out of jail free morales, also why you are seeing MDPS+SW comps imo so you aren't SoL for 10 seconds in say a slayer/WL group in terms of heal debuff.

I'm not saying people don't die, just that one skill in particular stands above everything else only thing that really rivals it is incoming healdebuff. The meta would turn inside out if either of these was nerfed/tweaked/removed, certain things like MDPS mechanically would break down as well.

It also does give a massive advantage to premades over pugs, but that's just a pug argument who cares. Good communication (voice) gives you the most out of guard, having purpose built groups gives you the most out of guard, 2 things pugs lack. Also im sure you have solo qued into sc's and notice the total lack of **** any tanks will give for random DPS in their party in terms of them functioning as tanks and guarding people.


Guard is cool and all, I wouldn't change it... but personally I think it needs more counterplay. And morale situation needs to be figured out, and stating that destro should have a better morale environment over order as one of their advantages gives me a brain aneurysm just fix knight already.

[Sigimund]

Guard is a powerful mechanic. Healing is a powerful mechanic. Building a party without a tank should be like building a party without a healer.

Guard is the main way this game stops tanks from being DPS who traded some of their damage for heavy armour like so many other MMOs.

[saupreusse]

I always disliked that the only true counter to guard is punting the enemy. I once made the suggestion to add a 3-5 sec cooldown to it, to make it more counterable through target switching, but i got so much hate that i wont suggest this again. Also, you need guard to keep those squishy slayers alive, otherwise the high burst classes like bw and sorc would just bomb your party.

[roadkillrobin]

Guard can't really be altered, its a fundamental part of the game. And any changes to it would also ressult in the need to eaither a: Universal change to damage mitigration, b: Universal change to dps output, c: both of the above but a smaller amount.

[Tesq]

In a game with so many burst an hard counter to a base function which keeps melee player alive should have no counter at all. Remove 1 ppl from the fight which provide it, it's a cheesy move for me, only few classes should have a strong kb which of course are not kobs/chosen and of course with the best CD off all kB

[shaggyboomboom]

If people neglect to use Guard, thats their issue. We can't be changing solid mechanics cause pugs can't or flat out refuse to use it.

EDIT: Getting the Enemy addon, binding the Guard ability on the party frames upon clicking and watching the healthbars isn't THAT hard. A bit of Enemy markers on your team and it's easier than you think it is.

[NSKaneda]

What are you people on? Changing guard? L2P pls and stop changing Warhammer into n00b-friendly, mirrored, boring GW2

Edit: install enemy addon and keybind guard - problem solved. How hard is it?

[Satoq]

Nonetheless, Guard in it's current form is boring gameplay. I would love to see it changed into a more active skill. This would force any tank to think about how to position themselves properly during battle and when to use it (use guard, use cc or any other skill?).

How, I don't know. Will it work? No clue. It would be a game-changer though.

Cone based (90deg) on a 0-3 sec CD.. I'll let our resident forum warriors ponder about it.

Anyways.. Guard doesn't take that much skill right now. Unless you have a hard time tracking healthbars and/or don't have a clue how and who to prioritize during combat.


Just a wish. Probably not feasible.