about exploits

[Azarael]

Yes, my consistently contrarian friend. You are testers first and players second. Please tell me what part of "testing" involves exploiting bugs once discovered, rather than reporting the bug, ceasing its use and desisting from further use.

[bloodi]

Well, i dont know about your country but in mine, its strictly forbidden to name who is in jail and for what reason, i specifically know this because a childhood friend of mine was supposedly in jail and we simply didnt trust his girlfriend on the matter, so we wanted to know for sure, a call to where he was gave us that answer "we cannot tell you, he has to say it himself".

This is done because the punishment also implies reinsertion after its done, things like people say here like "i want to know their name so i refuse them if they want into my guild". You commited a crime, you paid the time and that should be enough.

No scarlet letters please.

[Azarael]

No idea where you live but here in the UK we have articles all the time reporting crimes, their perpetrators and the punishments issued. I personally don't give a damn about secondary repercussions for knowingly violating the rules, and I think the concept is absolutely great. I even think that some people would fear more having their reputations harmed than they would fear the temp ban. Damage is permanent, bans are temporary.

[Zanilos]

Well what's not helping here is that we agreed a while back that bans of 1 day or longer would be posted in the Bans forum. This was for transparency reasons and to protect GMs from malicious accusations.

Now, there's something I don't get here.

Why do people jump to protect players who were banned?

Why should I or anyone else give a crap about what the repercussions are for a banned player if the reason and duration of his ban is made public? Shouldn't that be something I should wish to encourage, as it offers a greater incentive for players to obey those rules which, if broken, would incur the universal wrath of the playerbase?

If it's good enough for the real life justice system, it's good enough for us. Name them. This "name and shame is bad" **** has to stop. Name and shame is bloody great, because it pillories people who deserve to be pilloried.

This. Pretty much sums my feeling towards this.

Bretins ban thread was updated straight away, no one else was mentioned. ( not sticking up for him only using as an example)

Some people really **** up. REALLY **** up. The player base will find ways to find them and out them.

[bloodi]

I just think that if someone **** up, he should not have to wear a cross on their back for the rest of their lives.

Its not always malice, most of the time is simple and plain stupidity.

[Nekkma]

I have not seen anyone defending exploiters in this thread. The only defence is for specific names who got accused and then refuted themself or had friends that did it.

Ultimatly this is the staff's decision but I thought it was settled as the first thread on this very topic got locked pretty much immedietly.

[Jaycub]

I just think that if someone **** up, he should not have to wear a cross on their back for the rest of their lives.

Its not always malice, most of the time is simple and plain stupidity.

It's a game, also it's pretty hard to just "**** up" and get banned on this server... and if it really was a fluke you can appeal it.

GM's should just post a mega thread for this exploit and name all the accounts/characters honestly.

[bloodi]

Kids can be kids and **** up real badly and realize their **** up in 1 year or two, has happened plenty before.

And if you really want to know, people already gave you the answer, anyone you really want to know you can check them in the armory and see their renown rank, if its low, he was resetted for exploiting it.

[Danielle]

Well what's not helping here is that we agreed a while back that bans of 1 day or longer would be posted in the Bans forum. This was for transparency reasons and to protect GMs from malicious accusations.

Now, there's something I don't get here.

Why do people jump to protect players who were banned?

Why should I or anyone else give a crap about what the repercussions are for a banned player if the reason and duration of his ban is made public? Shouldn't that be something I should wish to encourage, as it offers a greater incentive for players to obey those rules which, if broken, would incur the universal wrath of the playerbase?

If it's good enough for the real life justice system, it's good enough for us. Name them. This "name and shame is bad" **** has to stop. Name and shame is bloody great, because it pillories people who deserve to be pilloried.

Because it's a double-edged sword. By not naming and shaming you say a person receives a 3 day-ban, that's the just punishment and that will be that for this offense. By making their names public you put the punishment outside of your own power. It means an individual could be refused the access to any guild, others wouldn't trade goods with them and perhaps I could make a guild called 'Exploiter Hunters' who would make sure these players' time in the game is living hell. Someone could decide such players don't deserve the right to play on this server find their IP and keep DDoSing them whenever they try to play. Of course I am exaggerating a whole lot here, but you get the idea. However, if community vendettas are something you would like to have, then I suggest you go right ahead and make these names public.

[Gobtar]

Shame is a powerful tool, but can also promote bully culture. Th NA justice system has a split-view when it comes to justice. Is justice designed to punish those so the public can have vengeance or is it to rehabilitate those who break the law. I personally think North America suffers from this more than any other modern culture...blah blah blah

I think if you want to make an example of someone then fine, but if the ban is temporary than you believe that they can redeem themselves, if so I don't feel it's appropriate to add shaming to the punishment because the punishment should not delivered by players, and bullying should not be incentivized in any form.