Nerfed Buttons

[Akalukz]

cast sequence i believe.

Also nerf slayer addon

[Gachimuchi]

1: Thats your opinions. My opinion is that a descisions is made by a action. Without a action its still just a sugestion. Noone is pressing the button for you.

2: So I gues you didn't read my post about my friend with Reumatism. Who can't play this game without addons that sequences abillties coz he can't reach more then 2 keys at once? And while on the topic were do you stand on voice activated keyboards were you don't even have to press a button?
What a pile of nonsense from you. Again.
1: Thats a fact, NB is pressing buttons for you. NB is cancerous exploit and Mythic was too lazy to ban it, because they suck. If you too blind to see that, thats your problem.
2: Nobody cares about your "mystery friend" with Reumatism. Make him good AHK script and let him do PVE. You are not supposed to play pvp game with few buttons, thats plain stupid. If you can't play PvP game with lowest skill demand then simply uninstall.

I have you on ignore just so I'm not subjected to your extreme inability to read but reading Penril's post and seeing what you wrote triggered me.

1. No, it isn't an exploit. I see you calling it a cheat/hack/etc and you are wrong. Full stop. I don't know if your irrational hate of this addon spawns from willful ignorance or just stupidity, but you have presented no valid arguments; not once.

2. If you think facerolling a bunch of buttons makes you a 'skilled player', heres a reality check: this game is very easy. It has a low skill ceiling. The most advanced of techniques are assisting which takes all of one button, and then guard swapping which requires some degree of situational awareness.

[grendel1892]

Okay, so if we get a vote, I vote to keep NB.

If I understand things correctly the reasons for wanting it gone are something like this

1) It makes decisions for the player.
This is complete nonsense. NB cannot make a decision. The player must decide which button to press, and when to press it. NB simply allows the player to make some of those decisions ahead of time, in the real world we call that training. It is simply the difference between do I press button 1 or button 2. if you are going to remove it you should also remove keybinds and programmable mice and other player aids, and every other Add-on in the game.

2) its a improves reaction time.
This is nonsense as well. the player pushes the button. ALL NB can do is string a predefined decision together. This is simply TYPING. some people can type well, others can't. If your goal is to teach people to TYPE better then go ahead and remove NB. I sure as hell don't play a game for typing skill development. If that is your idea of a "Skilled player" count me out.

[altgrimreaper]

Take it out. It will be funny when all the pros using it have the playing field leveled.

I find it hard to believe that new players and average players who do not have extensive knowledge of the game are using conditionals. Only experienced players are doing that.

Bring it on!

[drmordread]

Take it out. It will be funny when all the pros using it have the playing field leveled.

I find it hard to believe that new players and average players who do not have extensive knowledge of the game are using conditionals. Only experienced players are doing that.

Bring it on!

And what will you complain about when you are still getting killed? At least with NB around you, and all the others, can pat yourselves on the back and say NB killed you. (Not true because NB can't do that). Without NB what will you blame next? Mice? Keyboards? Mutants with ten fingers on each hand?

[DonCarlos]

Step 1: if it ain't broken don't fix it.
Step 2: It rests with the plaintiff to submit evidence.
Step 3: I have seen no evidence for NB to be broken. Go to Step 1

P.S. I'm not even using it.

[Azarael]

Okay, so if we get a vote, I vote to keep NB.

If I understand things correctly the reasons for wanting it gone are something like this

1) It makes decisions for the player.
This is complete nonsense. NB cannot make a decision. The player must decide which button to press, and when to press it. NB simply allows the player to make some of those decisions ahead of time, in the real world we call that training. It is simply the difference between do I press button 1 or button 2. if you are going to remove it you should also remove keybinds and programmable mice and other player aids, and every other Add-on in the game.

2) its a improves reaction time.
This is nonsense as well. the player pushes the button. ALL NB can do is string a predefined decision together. This is simply TYPING. some people can type well, others can't. If your goal is to teach people to TYPE better then go ahead and remove NB. I sure as hell don't play a game for typing skill development. If that is your idea of a "Skilled player" count me out.

I'm getting tired of having to repeat myself.

It makes decisions for the player.

It can be configured to make a selection between one or more alternatives.

That is what we call "making a decision".

That these alternatives are specified by the player in advance does not invalidate that NB is capable of making a decision.

It reacts faster than the player can because it is capable of instantly reading the game state at the time the button is pressed.

If, without NB, I move to apply a CC and the enemy receives one of the many immunities to it during the time between my intention to apply it and my actual application of the skill, it is almost certain that I will blow the skill into his immunity - I am relied upon to correctly spot the relevant immunity and react by not activating the skill.

If, with NB, I do the same, NB will block the skill, regardless of whether I spot the immunity or whether I even have my UI configured to prioritize those immunities at all.

That is a zero ms reaction time.

Stop pretending to be incapable of understanding basic English to attempt to make a point.

It is not going to work.

The principle here is very simple. Addons which display information in a different fashion should be permitted. Addons which remove any element of the player's interaction or decision-making process within the game should not. The moment any addon removes your need to make any kind of decision or reaction in real-time is the moment it starts playing the game for you and the moment that it should be banned.

[roadkillrobin]

't. If your goal is to teach people to TYPE better the

I'm getting tired of having to repeat myself.

It makes decisions for the player.

It can be configured to make a selection between one or more alternatives.

That is what we call "making a decision".

That these alternatives are specified by the player in advance does not invalidate that NB is capable of making a decision.

It reacts faster than the player can because it is capable of instantly reading the game state at the time the button is pressed.

If, without NB, I move to apply a CC and the enemy receives one of the many immunities to it during the time between my intention to apply it and my actual application of the skill, it is almost certain that I will blow the skill into his immunity - I am relied upon to correctly spot the relevant immunity and react by not activating the skill.

If, with NB, I do the same, NB will block the skill, regardless of whether I spot the immunity or whether I even have my UI configured to prioritize those immunities at all.

That is a zero ms reaction time.

Stop pretending to be incapable of understanding basic English to attempt to make a point.

It is not going to work.

The principle here is very simple. Addons which display information in a different fashion should be permitted. Addons which remove any element of the player's interaction or decision-making process within the game should not. The moment any addon removes your need to make any kind of decision or reaction in real-time is the moment it starts playing the game for you and the moment that it should be banned.

And we're dissagreeing with you. I hate to repeat myself aswell. But making a sugestion for the player wich skill he should use isn't the same as making the sugestion and preforming it. That is making a descision for the player.
NB is making a descision for the addon itself without a action its still just a sugestion. I got problem with the reaction time argument aswell. Theres a GCD in this game wich is far longer then the reaction time of moast players.

[Cimba]

Alright I would appreciate a thread in the balance forum about this where every post that doesn't contribute to the discussion gets kicked out.

I personally use NB to some extend on all my chars just to remove input errors like using CC one immune targets. For this NB probably should be removed. There shouldn't be an addon that saves your ass if you made a mistake.

The question is then where do we stop with disabling addons? After all enemy gives you precise information about the distance to your guarded fellow and informs you instantly if you moved to far away. With my modest tanking experience I would argue that's vital information and a distinctive advantage over someone who doesn't have access to such addons.
Similar things could be said for Buffhead most people, me included, probably consider the option to display buffs over peoples heads as harmless. However you can use it to locate enemies through structures allowing you avoid traps. In rvr I avoided entire warbands because the head buffs are displayed before the enemies are even in clipping range.

So the question for me is not really if NB should be banned or not. The question is, what is next in line.

PS: I don't mind either if NB stays.

[Panzerkasper]

Spoiler:

't. If your goal is to teach people to TYPE better the

I'm getting tired of having to repeat myself.

It makes decisions for the player.

It can be configured to make a selection between one or more alternatives.

That is what we call "making a decision".

That these alternatives are specified by the player in advance does not invalidate that NB is capable of making a decision.

It reacts faster than the player can because it is capable of instantly reading the game state at the time the button is pressed.

If, without NB, I move to apply a CC and the enemy receives one of the many immunities to it during the time between my intention to apply it and my actual application of the skill, it is almost certain that I will blow the skill into his immunity - I am relied upon to correctly spot the relevant immunity and react by not activating the skill.

If, with NB, I do the same, NB will block the skill, regardless of whether I spot the immunity or whether I even have my UI configured to prioritize those immunities at all.

That is a zero ms reaction time.

Stop pretending to be incapable of understanding basic English to attempt to make a point.

It is not going to work.

The principle here is very simple. Addons which display information in a different fashion should be permitted. Addons which remove any element of the player's interaction or decision-making process within the game should not. The moment any addon removes your need to make any kind of decision or reaction in real-time is the moment it starts playing the game for you and the moment that it should be banned.

And we're dissagreeing with you. I hate to repeat myself aswell. But making a sugestion for the player wich skill he should use isn't the same as making the sugestion and preforming it. That is making a descision for the player.
NB is making a descision for the addon itself without a action its still just a sugestion. I got problem with the reaction time argument aswell. Theres a GCD in this game wich is far longer then the reaction time of moast players.[/quote]

What an argument!
So you are saying the addon makes a "suggestion" to the player, the player stops for a second, thinks about it and presses another button because the "suggestion" of the addon was "too good"? Are you serious?
It makes decisions for the player, because it is configured to bringt the right option at the right time.

The GCD is 1 second what is the reaction time of a normal human beeing and some things happen between GCD. An Immunity can pop up at 0.9 sec of you gcd and you tell me a human is fast enough to decide in 0.1 sec to not press the button for a knockdown?