Nerfed Buttons

[peterthepan3]

I think all addons are inconsequential. Everything we need is already in the game...get rid of then all.

It really isn't. If you want to be competitive in war, you can not rely on WAR's default ui/settings because they are pretty **** tbh.

[Morbidmind]

So you're saying Penril needs to practice his thumb WAR game?

[roadkillrobin]

All Ive been reading is arguments why it should stay and very few why it should go. Moast people who are against NB just states thats its a cheat without any elaboration.

Rubbish. The arguments against NB have been made repeatedly.

1. Makes decisions for the player by analysing the game. Selecting or blocking a skill for a situation based on conditions is what the player should do, not an addon. It should be bannable based on this alone. Let me also add that it can make this selection faster than is humanly possible. NB can check something at the very instant that the client processes it, so it does not have the approximately 200-300ms reaction time of a human.

2. Reduces execution load. If you can't handle however many keybinds your class needs or execute the rotations required without help, then you don't deserve to. Whether you like it or not, managing key allocations and executing the right combinations without making a mistake is a skill. If you don't have it, you should not be able to delegate it to any kind of addon to do it for you.

Most of the NB defenders resort to things like "Oh if NB were gone we'd play just the same and you'd have to blame something else."

So, there's no problem, then. Away with it and let's see money put where your mouths are. If the addon is so damn inconsequential, then we can get rid of it without a single complaint, can't we?

1: Thats your opinions. My opinion is that a descisions is made by a action. Without a action its still just a sugestion. Noone is pressing the button for you.

2: So I gues you didn't read my post about my friend with Reumatism. Who can't play this game without addons that sequences abillties coz he can't reach more then 2 keys at once? And while on the topic were do you stand on voice activated keyboards were you don't even have to press a button?

[Penril]

12 buttons, 11 skills, and you say you cant fit everything on your mouse, bro either start practicing them thumb gymnastics or then you're not playing this game right. Just saying


edit: Ps: iz a joke, not get angryrinno pleaserrino

Actionbar from YakUI allows for 11 skills. Sure I could fit them all on my 12 buttons mouse, but some classes have way more than 12 skills that you constantly need to use.

However you are correct that I need to practice my thumb gymnastics; reaching the bottom 3 sidebuttons is a pain in the ass.

In the end if NB is removed I could just add a alt/ctrl/shift keybind and keep using my mouse. It won't hurt me that much (but it will definitely be less comfortable).

@Aza: being able to reach 2365235534 keybinds = skill? Totally disagree. You have some Mobas out there with like only 5 or 6 skills which require WAY more skill than WAR. Mobas with tournaments that grant thousands of dollars in prizes as well.

[Osred]

1. Makes decisions for the player by analysing the game. Selecting or blocking a skill for a situation based on conditions is what the player should do, not an addon. It should be bannable based on this alone. Let me also add that it can make this selection faster than is humanly possible. NB can check something at the very instant that the client processes it, so it does not have the approximately 200-300ms reaction time of a human.

2. Reduces execution load. If you can't handle however many keybinds your class needs or execute the rotations required without help, then you don't deserve to. Whether you like it or not, managing key allocations and executing the right combinations without making a mistake is a skill. If you don't have it, you should not be able to delegate it to any kind of addon to do it for you.

This. ^

Removing decision making and situational awareness and making a computer do it and make decisions for you is literally cheating.

2: So I gues you didn't read my post about my friend with Reumatism. Who can't play this game without addons that sequences abillties coz he can't reach more then 2 keys at once? And while on the topic were do you stand on voice activated keyboards were you don't even have to press a button?

You've lost the argument so you resorted to ''oh but think of these people in this rare anecdotal situation don't remove it''

[Foofighter]

at least 20 thumb wars when he wakes up, after lunch and before bed XD

[Foofighter]

12 buttons, 11 skills, and you say you cant fit everything on your mouse, bro either start practicing them thumb gymnastics or then you're not playing this game right. Just saying


edit: Ps: iz a joke, not get angryrinno pleaserrino

Actionbar from YakUI allows for 11 skills. Sure I could fit them all on my 12 buttons mouse, but some classes have way more than 12 skills that you constantly need to use.

However you are correct that I need to practice my thumb gymnastics; reaching the bottom 3 sidebuttons is a pain in the ass.

preach! i know the feeling my razor naga has warped my right thumb for life

[Nekkma]

sure, while it is true that other add ons also give aid to pvp ( buffhead, guard distance) we agree that without these playing tanks and healers in this game would be more of a headache then skill, tiny buff displays that you cant even make out what buffs are on who, and no way of telling if you are in guard range ( personally i hate this one, occupiest to much room on the screen and i feel it worthless unless im playing wb vs wb).

Now saying this , and i'm not adding any hyperbole as requested, nerfed buttons thinks for you, it dosetn show you what buttons you can and can't press it does it for you, you dont need to care wether your positioned to do this or positioned to do that and doing it, you just need to press your keybind and the addon will use the perfect ability for the right time, people dont want casting sequences they want something that will stop them from spamming a button that for some reason( playing badly) the game tells you you cant use. Now the more detail you put into the decision making of the addon the better it is, only means people who understand the game better( which is different from playing better, i know right what a **** shocker) can do awesome rotations and dont need to play well ( mechanically) because the addon is doing it for them.

i think i made this long enough, and it's already confusing because i can't write worth **** but i hope some of you who are kidding yourself s in telling this dosent give you an advantage, an advantage that can not be compared to seeing buffs and seeing what distance you guard is, might think a bit better and for those who know they get and advantage and do it because otherwise they wouldn't know how to do a rotation because it's on more then 4 keybinds, well since you showed you're not willing to pratice to become better and i can't do anything about it i guess i'll see around the rvr lakes and thats it

I have never disputed that it is an advantage but that is not an issue because almost all addons are. My argument to keep it is basically that i do not think a removal will make the game better. As I am here because i loved AOR I prefer a restoration of that game with as few changes as possible. In short, I want the AOR experience.

About your middle paragraph, where your argument are, I do not fully agree with the picture you are painting. In particualar i disagree with the description "the addon will use the perfect ability for the right time". This may be true in some situations but it will in my opinion be just as many situations where the string leads to bad choices. This was part of the exaggerations I was meaning, e.g. "always perfect ablities" and "1 button".


About the automation agrument. I think this is more of personal opinions about how a game should be designed. This is not an argument at all but rather a value judgement and as such not much to discuss as people will have different views on this. For instance, some people like "targeted abilities" where as some prefer "skill shot". Neither preference is wrong, just different.

[Vigfuss]

Most games like this one have a built in macroing system with a lot more limitations than you have with NB. I think it was because WAR doesn't have macroing built in(except for /assist /target and chat stuff) that they allowed the addon on live. I'm sure that without NB players from Rift and WoW would have had a really hard time adapting to WAR if they're used to just pressing 4 buttons.

[Zealote]

I'm past the point now of being willing to write long responses and counterarguments (feel free to interpret that as my being unable to ), as I imagine some other people are.

What'd be better, imo, is if either the devs could state an official stance (if there's internal agreement), whether that be "keep"/"remove"/"decision deferred until a later date" etc, or else make an official thread with strict moderation that collates all the arguments, if they feel more community input and discussion is still needed.

Hopefully that doesn't come across as trying to tell anyone (dev or anyone else) what to do; I just think that something like the above would be more fruitful than this thread continuing at this point, even though there have actually been quite a lot of interesting posts imo.