Well first of all if you play in a group or not has nothing to do with skill there are still plenty of good players who just play alone and to be honest if you get a group which concists of good players it can matter a lot. Warhammer needs such a specific combination of players that it is nearly impossible to get this by rdm this is the only reason premade vs pug is so many times so extremely onesided.Eathisword wrote:Hell yes, and guard has nothing to do with it.Landaren wrote: Stuff...
Should playing with a group of friends be rewarding? Yes
Should you go 40-0? Hell no.
In WoW (or any PvP game with ladders), take a group of friends that also happen to be 2400 mmr in Battleground (10v10), and let em queue random games versus pug... They can go 200-0 easy peasy while being more Drunk then Halhammer. And WoW has no guard. Heck, they could even only have 1 healer instead of 3 and go 200-0. They could even go against other premades that are 2000 mmr and they'd still win 200 games in a row...
Guard is irrelevant to the fact that less skilled/unorganized players will get pooped on by stronger, more organized players. Nothing will change that. And tbh, you can make a ''premade'' with 2 engineer 2 BW and 2 heals and win 40 games in a row vs PuG. You can do it with 6 melee dok. Same with 3 pew pew AM and 3 keg engie. Basically any comp that focus fire and has some kind of heals will destroy a pug.
Arguing that tanks must be looked at because Guard is a must have is like saying healers should be looked at, because their healing is a must have. And so on with dps, heal debuff and CC. It makes no sense. All those things are a must have in a complete group. IT is what makes this game what it is: no class can do it all. Edit : except IB... IB is op
Having tanks that use guard or healers in your group is essential for success so yes guard does matter and fights get onesided very quickly if you don't have them.
Okay do you grp with 2 engis and 2 bws and some heal you will get killed by rdms in no time if they manage to get a correct grp setup. +Perhaps you win the match but with such a setup you will most definitly die several times.
You can even manage to win matches without heal if you fight against setups without tanks as long as you have propper dds (and yes propper dd's focus together even when they play rdm) the min is getting some fun out of it because you manage to kill something while it's nearly impossible to manage that against grp setups with tanks.
You talk about other games WoW and mmr but mmr is often related to the amout of matches you did. How you describe it a team which managed to get to 2400 mmr is indestructible but that is just flat wrong. MMR is often wrong and new teams and teams which doesn't do many matches are often wrongly representet in mmr's so teams which climb up the latter can wup your asses pretty quickly if they know what they do.
So any other MMO with latters, lets take GW2 you can easily win a fight against teams with a rdm and matches tend to be way less onesided than it's the case here why is this the case because rdms can chance their setup in order to have a working group. Yes your chances to win are low (against good teams) but you still have a chance. A match in warhammer on the other side where you start with 0 heal or no tank against a premade is just a painful roflstomp even if they (the premade) are bad players the mechanics puts them in such a huge favor that win anyway.
Still I'm not really for a harsh guard chance or not even sure for a chance but something should happen if it's rdm only sc's (or small grp of 2) or you guys make it possible to switch characters at the beginning of a sc (removing this 20s logout timer would be essential for that) it happens often enough that people complain that they just changed to heal and exactly then you join a sc which already has 6 of them.
Some other point
However even if it is now not the biggest problem crit dmg will likely be one of the problems in the future classes which offer bigger crit dmg bonus will get in huge favor with upcomming equipments. Atm sorc and BW already dominate the field this will get even worse with progressing equipment because they get a bigger benefit out of additional stats then others will so a chance for such things should also be on the table.
