(Poll) Reikland Factory is perfect, but only for 2/3 ?

[Telen]

Des have a way up onto upper from their corner flag. Order dont on theirs.

[Arena]

Des have a way up onto upper from their corner flag. Order dont on theirs.

You saying destro can run to that stairs near upper flag at the same time as order set their positions above central flag using nearest stairs, and then they can make fight at the same height?

As i running premade i dont remember we using that stairs near upper flad even once, it just too long to make up there and go over that rail road before you being discovered or loose sight of the enemy.

[warhammer69]

Love this scenario , my favourite! New set up is preferred.

[Telen]

Des have a way up onto upper from their corner flag. Order dont on theirs.

You saying destro can run to that stairs near upper flag at the same time as order set their positions above central flag using nearest stairs, and then they can make fight at the same height?

As i running premade i dont remember we using that stairs near upper flad even once, it just too long to make up there and go over that rail road before you being discovered or loose sight of the enemy.

Why? Des goto their corner anyway.

If Order goto their corner and they clash across the rear of the sc. Des ranged could use the stairs to get above order but dont. If Order goto the middle from their corner they can use those stair to get above them at mid. Order only benefit if both mindlessly zerg for mid.
Also the tunnels can still be used from the sides to go straight under mid to the other sides flag. Lot of routes that ppl still dont use as they are stuck in the concept of running after each other to the enemy as quick as possible which it always b ecame a spawn camp over bridge.

[Arena]

Why? Des goto their corner anyway.
If Order goto their corner and they clash across the rear of the sc. Des ranged could use the stairs to get above order but dont. If Order goto the middle from their corner they can use those stair to get above them at mid. Order only benefit if both mindlessly zerg for mid.
Also the tunnels can still be used from the sides to go straight under mid to the other sides flag. Lot of routes that ppl still dont use as they are stuck in the concept of running after each other to the enemy as quick as possible which it always b ecame a spawn camp over bridge.

No, you talk about random groups who want only to gain as much points (emblems) as posible. Those groups not use tactic or strategy, if they fight - they fight face to face. Tanks go forward and healers/rdd stay behind/above is not strategy, it is only formation.
Premades on the other hand use strategy, they want to defeat enemy, not gain points. Sometimes to make unexpected attack you need to sacrifice flags and points. That is why that stairway near upper flag is not used by premades - it is too open, you being seen there and can't perform something unexpected.

[Telen]

Premades goto the bridge and spawn camp pugs not letting them out of spawn saw it for years on live. There wasnt even one order premade queued last night so why change sc for a minority?

[drmordread]

RF is one of the worst designed scenarios Mythic ever made. Add to it that 90% of the players just rush to center over and over and over ad nauseum .... and it becomes the most boring nightmare sc ever.
Everyone just wants to kill ... well, this SC is not for that. RF is a PvE with PvP added sc. You must cap the flags. People do not want to do it ....
That is why it is blacklisted.

If you want a flag cap SC, delete RF and bring back Gromril's Crossing. At least in that one both sides have the tunnels to escape spawn if camped, and there is a lot more room to maneuver!

[Arena]

Premades goto the bridge and spawn camp pugs not letting them out of spawn saw it for years on live. There wasnt even one order premade queued last night so why change sc for a minority?

Premades not camp wc, if you see wc camped - there is no premades there, only random groups. If group use voice, it is not automatically make premade out of that group. 6 of not very smart people wont became premade if they manage to join party and sign up into ventrilo.

Also is RF only scenario where WC are happened to being camped? I've been seen that almost every scenario have that "camping" thing goin all the time when one side totally loses. No? Well i don't see posts with: oh, we've been camped on ... scenario, we need guardians up to middle of it.
How happened that RF is only one scenario having that changings and everybody feel good about it?

[Arena]

RF is one of the worst designed scenarios Mythic ever made. Add to it that 90% of the players just rush to center over and over and over ad nauseum .... and it becomes the most boring nightmare sc ever.
Everyone just wants to kill ... well, this SC is not for that. RF is a PvE with PvP added sc. You must cap the flags. People do not want to do it ....
That is why it is blacklisted.
If you want a flag cap SC, delete RF and bring back Gromril's Crossing. At least in that one both sides have the tunnels to escape spawn if camped, and there is a lot more room to maneuver!

IMO you just can not (or don't know how to) play in party, maybe you solo player and you need is only to capturing flags, to have more points, to win scenario, to have more medalions and feel good about yourself.
I think you can't make strategic plan and that's why you don't see benefits from all those paths RF gives to you, same reason makes you hate RF.
I already told before - there will always be people who will not be glad having premade groups on scenarios, you one of them. You think if you win scenario with 500 points but in the same time final kill score is 30 to 5 against your side - it is still glory victory. That's the reason.
Most of people not having fun from gaining numbers of points, most of people like to kill the enemies. And the flags is only there for stimulating people to move across scenario.
IMO.

[Valfaros]

"Destro also has a way up the railway." Yep that is true but it was always like that no changes there the changes that were made are just that destro can't cross "lane" to get up behinde the range dd's. So that is just no excuse since that never changed. +Really you can't compare these two ways one way is compleatly safe because you just can move back to spawn with a jump and the other way is at the end of the map where you can get easily killed if someone gets up there.

I know why you guys don't want the crossing because it just crushes range dd's up there. Yep for order this SC is pretty nice, I get it I like it on my BW too. You just get up there snipe everyone who dares to go mid down and if someone goes up you just make a few steps back in the safe zone of your spwan. If you look where the people are moving there is no way a meele can get to you and kill you. Pretty nice yep but it's just not fair and in my opinion just lame play.

If you say removing the guards allow spawn camp than you certaintly didn't play the SC enough. There is still spawn camping sometimes that happens in every SC where a side is dominating so where is the point.
In order to make the SC fair again just set the guards back a bit. We only need a passage to cross lanes so we can get on the ramp again. Make it clear where the line is put a flag or something and everybody will be happy.

There will really be no big difference to current state if you just make us a passage.