Mara vs WL

[roadkillrobin]

No the Zerg is the dominating force not AoE. And AoE only way to deal with it.

[Azarael]

Right on both counts. Bombing is a symptom of a problem, not its root. Accordingly, bombing itself should be left alone.

Marsares hit it dead-on on the previous page.

[dasset]

Can't wait to see what the proposed changed to zone locks are going to be. Thursdays are essentially zerg nights where it doesn't even get to keep attacks or defenses because the huge destro blob never splits up to take BOs.

[Scrilian]

Spoiler:

Your response really doesn't warrant a response because (a) you read whatever you wish to read in my post, rather than what I wrote because (b) you're too wedded to your AOE play-style to open your mind to other opportunities and (c) the way you write in a rather childish and biased way belies a very poor attempt at trolling. Talking to a wall would therefore be more beneficial.

However, what I will say is this: AOE-based WB requires skill to coordinate 24 people at a group level, it requires comparatively less individual skill as AOE by nature is dependant on chance (AOE caps, anyone?).

And that's fine. Everyone prefers a different playstyle. However, not everyone likes to stack two WBs on top of each other, sit in a keep for two hours and AOE funnel the living daylights out of others. The difference between you and me is that I promote diversity by giving both ST and AOE a part in the game, you - on the other hand - only wish to see AOE as the dominant force.

Luckily, Azareal is also not a fan of the dominance of AOE.

You want to play single target in the game of large scale battles with huge numbers of people from both sides, despise "AOE funneling" and want the game to be changed to fit your desired playstyle while going an extra mile to show that you are all in it for the better of everyone and somehow too possess the moral high ground in this.

Advocating for some fantasy equality of ST and AOE that will without a doubt ruin the game for one or the other in my opinion.
The game diverse with it's gameplay as it is, just class representation a bit struggling to be on par with other AOE speccs, and ST is already the way to go in small scale and SCs, so now why it is needed to make it relevant even in large scale battles. AOE will even fall a bit down in terms of damage with higher mitigation and healthpools of t4 and it is dominant force because it should be.

It's the ways where can you apply it should be addressed, ways of forcing massive zergs to split with some new ways of RvR campaign.

[spikespiegel84]

It remains a mystery to me the reason why people prefer bombing.
But fun is fun, as you get it it's not up to us to judge.
I'm only asking if someone can explain WHY you would willingly chose to stay in a single place, sometimes for hours in keep defense, and do the same thing all over again, instead moving and measure yourself with a lot of different situations, diverse tactics etc.

[roadkillrobin]

The dmg nerf that took place in like 2010 I agree with. The problem at that point was that AoE did way to much dmg. a AoE 6man could stand toe to toe against a ST based 6man or 12 man and win. The 9 target cap limitation had almoast no effect on this.

[Nekkma]

Not really, but promoting other ways of playing is a good idea and bombing just doesn't require skill (whereas - believe it or not - even WoW pvp did, and was even ESL)

The main difference skillvise between smaller ST fights and larger bombing fights is target selection (ST) and coordinated movement (bombing). Claiming bombing "doesn't require skill" is a silly and obviously false statement. If that where the case no wb scale guild on live would have ever stood out as better or worse. Everyone that played in semi-serious wbs on live knows very well that there was a huge difference in the performance of various guilds and, no, that difference did not only come from setup.

[peterthepan3]

Bombing is not that taxing at all...our guild do it occasionally for lols and then stop due to boredom.
Don't get me wrong I am sure there are varying degrees of bombing skill; but as a whole it is a montonous playstyle that reaps maximum reward for little risk and user input.

[Bretin]

the marauder and the wl are very well designed aoe classes and both (especially the wl) are taking the main dps role inside a bomb wb any time. it is really justified to discuss this matter here on now 3-4 pages. on a srs note: stop derailing and get an aoe topic going and discuss there. 10/10 would not read, here i get forced to it.

[Marsares]

You want to play single target in the game of large scale battles with huge numbers of people from both sides, despise "AOE funneling" and want the game to be changed to fit your desired playstyle while going an extra mile to show that you are all in it for the better of everyone and somehow too possess the moral high ground in this.

Advocating for some fantasy equality of ST and AOE that will without a doubt ruin the game for one or the other in my opinion.
The game diverse with it's gameplay as it is, just class representation a bit struggling to be on par with other AOE speccs, and ST is already the way to go in small scale and SCs, so now why it is needed to make it relevant even in large scale battles. AOE will even fall a bit down in terms of damage with higher mitigation and healthpools of t4 and it is dominant force because it should be.

It's the ways where can you apply it should be addressed, ways of forcing massive zergs to split with some new ways of RvR campaign.

Without meaning to sound derogatory, there are again major L2Read issues here. Perhaps English isn't your mother's tongue?

Pray tell where I said that the whole game should be revolved around my particular play-style, even more so when I said previously that I am in KO and both participate in WB, 6-men and solo roaming? I didn't promote nerfing of AOE bombing either, in fact I said that it's the zone mechanisms that promote blobbing, which in turn promote AOE. But, by all means, read what you will as your mind is set.

All I'm saying is that both AOE and ST should have a viable and equal role to play in RvR. Making this a reality is not a fantasy. It's only a fantasy in your mind because you can't divorce yourself from the idea that RvR is nothing more but 100vs100 blob battles. Battles in real life do not happen like that either. Yes, there are main forces clashing, but around them there are skirmishes, tactical smaller battles, 1v1s, etc.

There are four BOs for a reason, right? Why have the whole zone amalgamate and blob up on a single point, whilst ignoring the rest of the map. That should not be rewarded, and by not rewarding it and breaking up the mindless blobbing that some guilds (*cough*yours*cough*) advocate you give ST (like the WL) straight away a more rewarding role in RvR.