[Knight of the Blazing Sun] DPS or just a tank?

[Toldavf]

I see no point in taking a squshy tank in a party intead of true dps. the main reason why I am in a party - I can still myself guard DPS and deal good damage. If you need that tactics to actually dps on a tank - you should stay a tank, untill getting new gear or skills.

I agree with this pretty much. I'n my experience parry/block rates are a bit low to be specing into hybrid atm. When it come to the crunch and my dps is in trouble I'd rather be able to live through the guard damage and potential switch in focus. Playing chosen I know isn't the same as knight I have spirit damage although everyone is resistant to it these days but the main thing about being a tank is that I am most effective when im swapping guard and applying the right CC or debuffs.

Sever blessing for life <3

[peppex91]

I dunno your gear maybe u can, didn't mean to sentence...
i just never got impressed by a BG dps
We all know good scores means nothing, but pm me ingame if u wanna have a spar, i'll gladly be surprised by your offence/defence setup

[Shanell]

To shanell: Nha u can't deal good damage, your main concern will be guarding the dps and it's a fondamental role, while u can live without a 2h offence/tank .

B-but that's how I roll...

I dunno your gear maybe u can, didn't mean to sentence...
i just never got impressed by a BG dps
We all know good scores means nothing, but pm me ingame if u wanna have a spar, i'll gladly be surprised by your offence/defence setup

Can we try it right now?
Just found it. Of course I am not guarding random people, While I am alone I will stay by myself. If I am guarding someone - I am doin it in a premade, when I am sure i will get heal, if I will go low.

[TenTonHammer]

First off no, No matter what you will absolotuly never ever take the place of a dps, just because you slap on a 15% dmg increase and debuff your armor so hard that it basically becomes medium armor dosnt mean you will become equal to an mdps

No 2h tank on order can match the mobility or frontload burst of WL nor have the single best st pressure ability with ID nor their 50% inc HD and no DPS BG or BO sure as hell will never compare or replace mara choppa

you do not out put enough DPS even with FO, you do not have as much utlity and you dont provide 50% inc hd If you run 2h tank it would still be your second tank and it would/NEEDS spec defensively by maxing parry to mitigate guard dmg etc not this glass cannon nonsense so you can try to run to into the backlines in scs to try and kill sorcs

[Tesq]

-so 50% base armor penetration( 45-50% like any other melee) + 25% from skill= 70-75% armor penetration
-str cap 1050.
-30% taunt + 15% FO =45% damage increase

it feel like a slayer/choppa to me then add 3 auras, 1 challenge, 1 damage reduction skill (50%).... i want to start level a dps kobs..

:///

IDK where you are getting the 50% base armor pen, if its from Weapon skill + runefang it doesn't come close, its around ~35% after runefang, and idk how precision strike's armor is calculated, that is if its before or after WS. The damage reduction skill is in the defensive tree.

i have/had a sov choppa; 45% armor pen in sovereign and runfang value is higer than choppa/slayer str+wep skill tactic.

Warpforged kobs had 75% armor penetration in live (even if the 25% is calculated pre or after doing a % of a % you loose a 5% math done... which mean 65-75% depending by your wep skill which is higer than any 45-50% armor penetration on slayer. And you have 45% damage increase, as i said all of this is not aoe as ID spam. But that's another story and anyway no, the difference in mobility is really (was) few with proper itiems and flee + ap tactic if anything change that's also another story.

[Toldavf]

-so 50% base armor penetration( 45-50% like any other melee) + 25% from skill= 70-75% armor penetration
-str cap 1050.
-30% taunt + 15% FO =45% damage increase

it feel like a slayer/choppa to me then add 3 auras, 1 challenge, 1 damage reduction skill (50%).... i want to start level a dps kobs..

:///

IDK where you are getting the 50% base armor pen, if its from Weapon skill + runefang it doesn't come close, its around ~35% after runefang, and idk how precision strike's armor is calculated, that is if its before or after WS. The damage reduction skill is in the defensive tree.

i have/had a sov choppa; 45% armor pen in sovereign and runfang value is higer than choppa/slayer str+wep skill tactic.

Warpforged kobs had 75% armor penetration in live (even if the 25% is calculated pre or after doing a % of a % you loose a 5% math done... which mean 65-75% depending by your wep skill which is higer than any 45-50% armor penetration on slayer. And you have 45% damage increase, as i said all of this is not aoe as ID spam. But that's another story and anyway no, the difference in mobility is really (was) few with proper itiems and flee + ap tactic if anything change that's also another story.

My chopper had 60%+ in sov whut where you speccing?

[peppex91]

TentonHammer i can assure i can do more dps as a SM then the majority of pure-dps users out there with a full hoeth build, and with a khaine spec i could compete in ST burst too. It just take more effort in itemization.
I played some 6v6 with my guild, as a fully supp dps and never felt as a gimp.
PM me ingame if u don't believe me, or ask shanell xD

[Jaycub]

Just because you top the charts on your tanks doesn't mean ****. It means you played with awful DPS, or DPS that had no support (guard heals etc...). I have tons of scs where I can be #1 or 2 on my BG or SM but it's just laffs, If I am guarding a half decent slayer/WL I will never out dps them, and again scoreboard means ****, it's how it is delivered to the target, a knight who scoreboards 200k could of technically done less than a WH who did 20k.

The damage you deal is not dealt in the same way a true dps class deals it either, damage needs to be delivered to the target in short bursts to overcome healing. Again if you are guarding a real DPS and assisting your damage will be less then running around a scenario solo beating on people by yourself and spamming AoE mindlessly.

>Guard is situational
>FO is good
>your damage sucks with 400 str

WTF is going on m80s

Tanks cannot replace a DPS class, they can spec more offensively and do more DPS in a certain spec, but in any serious group they are there first and foremost to guard someone, and use tank only mechanics such as challenge/taunt/punt group buffs etc... I don't think I have ever seen a 6 man run a guarded tank except megladonis and pretty sure he is just doing that for fun or he really likes playing BO.

[TenTonHammer]

WTF is going on m80s

> Scientists Baffled

[Jaycub]

To build more on this, and to clarify. I am not saying 2h tanks are bad or not viable. I see this sentiment going around a lot that 2h tanks suck, cannot guard, etc... It's just that when you go 2h you are losing a lot of mitigation for an unequal amount of dps gain in comparison, meaning that your build in terms of stat distribution needs to be much more solid. This is where a lot of people fail I think when making a 2h tank. You go 2h to gain access to great-weapon only abilities, not to deal more damage.

You need high wounds and parry foremost in order to deal with guard damage, then you need spirit resistance to deal with bomb groups or sorc rotations on you, the most embarrassing thing that can happen to you as a 2h tank is to die before your guardee, becoming a burden to your group.

The best thing you can do as a tank no matter what spec you are in is to find a perfect spot in terms of your compromise between offense and defense, to the point where you are dealing as much damage as possible without the means of doing so interfering with your ability to guard, and be a tank.