Return of Reckoning

A while back I started a thread about the sad state of melee healing in this game, and especially about the Warrior (lol) Priest, that stillborn freak that is arguably the best at doing what he wasn't principally meant to do (casted heals) and hopeless at what his destiny could have led him to. I proposed a few adjustments, they were discussed, and some more adjustments were suggested.

Today I want to suggest ONE SINGLE change:

Make Sigmar's Radiance deal SPIRIT damage. The other two ways to return damage as health that the WP has (Divine Assault and Guilty Soul tactic) deal spirit damage. Spirit damage is also the damage dealt with Judgement, Soulfire and Prayer of Righteousness. Why not Sigmar's Radiance too? Fear of a spammable spirit damage ability? Take chosen's Ravage, for example, or SM's Ensorcelled Blow+EA tactic They only make them better at dealing the decent damage they are capable of, but no one would say Ravage makes Chosen OP as for example Terribad Embrace makes Mara OP, while making SR deal spirit damage would only make WP less hopeless at healing through damage. Think of it. Especially considering that we aren't talking about a "selfish" ability, but one that is designed to contribute to ALL the group and is NOT in the dps tree, but in Grace. I see some Archmage's damage-dealing abilities that only return health to one target and are almost always used for self healing which are far more OP than SR could ever be and no one questions them seriously.

Sigmar's Radiance is the only melee healing skill for his group that the WP has. Melee healing is all about SR. But with SR dealing physical damage, a class that cannot debuff armor and has no armor ignore will produce pitiful healing output compared to casted heals, and that having to sacrifice a LOT of survivability to achieve enough weapon skill, etc. You know the story....

With ONE SINGLE change you bring the staple skill for melee healing in line with the other damage-to-health abilities in the class, round off the class mechanics nicely, and most important, make melee healing less of a nightmare for the Warrior Priest.

OK, now you can burst my bubble.

remove the stupid tomes and chalices and make DoK n WP be the frontline healers they were ment to be

black line healers in medium armor stacking tough and spamming gheal and clense is stupid

Sigmar radiance itself already solves the damage problem, it heals a flat amount and then does a % based on the damage done, the flat heal amount is there to compensate for excessive armor.

The problem with melee healing imo is not the damage done, is simply the problem most hybrids have in this game, they have no room in 6 mans, they cannot replace a healer, they cannot replace a tank and they surely cannot replace a dps.

Add on top of that how a melee healer will not heal or support if he is cced and how more likely is to be cced if you are in melee and you have a deal breaker.

If you want melee healers to be viable you gotta give groups a reason to replace their tanks with them imo.

Coryphaus wrote:remove the stupid tomes and chalices and make DoK n WP be the frontline healers they were ment to be

black line healers in medium armor stacking tough and spamming gheal and clense is stupid

As cool as this sounds, it just means we would have 2 healing classes instead of 3 and we would have to welcome the Zealot/rp as the only good healer.

Removing the Tome and Chalice without taking steps to make WP and DoK viable melee healers in every tier, then proving that those taken steps worked, is suicide.

A burst damage-based game is hard for hybrids to deal with as well. This game favours strong contributions in a single role. However, knowing that this is the case, you can then increase the power of both aspects of the classes quite liberally.

bloodi wrote:
If you want melee healers to be viable you gotta give groups a reason to replace their tanks with them imo.

at this point im not sure anthing will break the ingrined cookie cutter mentality that persists from live RDPS like engie, sw, sh are not hybrids but iirc they were never run in 6 mans either

Coryphaus wrote:at this point im not sure anthing will break the ingrined cookie cutter mentality that persists from live RDPS like engie, sw, sh are not hybrids but iirc they were never run in 6 mans either

There is tangible reasons why Magus/engineer is not run in 6 mans, namely how they single target is garbage, their aoe is built around pressure (and thus UF) and their close range spec is built around a gimmick. Is not about cookie cutters, they are just not good for the metagame.

I have personally seen SW being run well on 6 mans, its also a m2 hero, you almost bet everything on that 7 seconds but they can be viable, i guess the same is for the SH.

Plenty of people try their best to break out of the mold and play differently however there is many valid reasons as to why the current meta classes are considered such, very valid reasons that have nothing to do with cookie cutters.

One of the reaosn that i advocate to nerf guard is because unless you do so, there is no way you can make hybrids replace what a tank brings, no amount of healing makes up for the cc and guard combo tanks give.

I vote against this. I like the synergy between melee WP and SM, but this change will pretty much force you to play such duo, otherwise melee WP will be even more useless then now as soon as enemy has a Chosen (which happens very often), while WS + armor debuffs from allies at least allow you to deal reasonable damage to squishies.

IMO, if something has to be changed here, it is not Radiance itself. There are plenty of useless or so-so skills and tactics, which can be changed to make melee WP more useful for party.

forget about hybrids, even mythic realised that and start balancing classes about their main role. You just cant balance hyrbid at this game, instead make wp/dok front line casting healers but inline with rest of the healers.
That mean buff rest healers or bring back dok/wp to some more adequate level. But that is topic for the times where ror progres to lvl 40
but wierd hybrid playstyle should be possible only for small scale \1v1, 2v2\

Nameless wrote:forget about hybrids, even mythic realised that and start balancing classes about their main role. You just cant balance hyrbid at this game

Thats another easy thing to say but AM/WP/DOK/Shaman all have 1 healing spec and the other 2 are damage and hybrid.

Telling 2/3 of the healing class to suck it aint a great idea dont you think?

Make difference between obtaining at decent lvl different roles at one time and having 2 roles at same time.
tanks got support, tanking and dps trees but that dont make them hybrid

if dok/wp spec dps they should not be good healers same as if they spec healing they should got pathetic dps