Since they are only affected by toughness, they seems to be kind of meh. If i lets say put up 900absorb on my BG with capped tough theres still like only200 less inc dmg compared to no bubble.
In short: 900absorb resulting in 200absorb in reality
Any thoughs on that?
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:44 am
by Darosh
Jinxypie wrote: Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:52 am
Since they are only affected by toughness, they seems to be kind of meh. If i lets say put up 900absorb on my BG with capped tough theres still like only200 less inc dmg compared to no bubble.
In short: 900absorb resulting in 200absorb in reality
Any thoughs on that?
Spoiler:
Judging by how Runic Blessing performs, don't quote me on it tho:
Bubbles are taken into account before crit, hence Runic Blessing entirely negating Sorc WoP/VoT.
Bubble procs (especially the Subjugator shield one) are well worth it on guardbots, guarddamge does proc them.
Bubbles in general are not a tool to combat sustained pressure, but bursts and/or fluff.
Keep in mind that HP pools range from 6 to 8-9k; a 200er bubble (Subjguator) covers 2,2-3,5% worth of HP ~ ten 200er bubbles cover 22,2%-35% worth of HP; 900er bubbles cover 10-15% of HP, e.g.: the BG bubble is an on-demand, unspecified bubble shared with the DP on a 10s CD iirc, thats 5,4k worth of HP (85-90%) or rather 10,8k with the sharing via DP over one minute.
To put it into perspective: If you consider a single wounds debuff (rez or otherwise); = ~10% hp loss, an issue you should fancy bubbles (i.e.: 3-4 [zero cost] subjugator bubble procs = 1 wounds debuff). Alternatively, removing about 1k from a timestamp, or even 500ish or so, is rather significant.
TLDR:
Usefulness is based on:
- proc chance, trigger, ICD (e.g.: guarddamage or w/e hitting you for 15ish proccing a 180-300 bubble = profit)
- value and specification (e.g.: Runic Blessing, healer m3, ... > else, because you can control what is when being negated)
- active or reactive; proc or on demand + class
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:29 am
by kindred4080
I'd say bubbles (aka absorb) brings more profit for squshies, and those who are under heavy focus and with -healdebuff.
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:05 pm
by Esperflame
Also, Bubbles are immune to crits.
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:13 pm
by Toldavf
bubbles are awesome, they just tend to go unnoticed by most.
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 2:12 pm
by Jinxypie
Thx for imput. Yeah the crit part is valuable for sure as well. Just the actual bubble numbers are a bit letdown.
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 4:05 pm
by Wiede
Esperflame wrote: Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:05 pm
Also, Bubbles are immune to crits.
wait... what does this mean?
Chance to be crit = 0 while absorb is up?
Re: How useful bubbles really are?
Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:14 pm
by Nameless
the problem with bubbles is that they dont scale with overall increase of stats. So at live for example on rr100 character with +10 000 hp on healer u got, what 300-400 bubble which is like 1 AA. Just barely worth GCD. On other hand proc bubbles are always a benefit=
Only real benefit on bubbles is that they negate healing debuffs.
If willpower effect bubbles size they will be at much better state. We are still far for rr80 gear so bubbles will get worse with time
Esperflame wrote: Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:05 pm
Also, Bubbles are immune to crits.
wait... what does this mean?
Chance to be crit = 0 while absorb is up?
Basically. Take WoP and Runic Blessing for example.
Tooltip is betwen 800-1k (depending on gear/mastery + tactic), Runic Blessing is a ~900er magic bubble; absorb is taken into account before crit, entirely negating WoP - leftover damage can crit tho, atleast judiging by my observation.
That is one of the infinite reasons IBs are such excellent guardbots and Slayer babysitter.
Abbd.:
Nameless wrote: Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:14 pm
the problem with bubbles is that they dont scale with overall increase of stats. So at live for example on rr100 character with +10 000 hp on healer u got, what 300-400 bubble which is like 1 AA. Just barely worth GCD. On other hand proc bubbles are always a benefit=
Only real benefit on bubbles is that they negate healing debuffs.
If willpower effect bubbles size they will be at much better state. We are still far for rr80 gear so bubbles will get worse with time
Take the example above, a Sorc can push upwards of +5k into a single timestamp - average HP as mentioned in my earlier post is between 6-9k, take into account the Sorc is being assisted for another 3k or so (in the tamest of scenarios), if you pop bubbles (WP bubble, IB bubble, pots, etc) in time to cover for WoP/VoT or WoP/AB thats atleast 3k of burst gone from a single timestamp.
If you do the math with GCDs, as you did in your example with the AA, take into account that your healers are limited by GCDs moreso than any other archetype.
Burst kills, mitigating a single AA worth of damage is 'fancy' ~ mitigating a single AA worth of damage within a burst window can make or break you.
Burst kills, mitigating a single AA worth of damage is 'fancy' ~ mitigating a single AA worth of damage within a burst window can make or break you.
the thing is that with stats rising with rr60-80 sets you will have situation where even healdebuffed heal will do more than bubble. So why use bubble then? Not to mention that some heals /direct ones/ proc different goodies while from bubble u got nothing. Willpower should effect bubbles size so they stay relevant to stats progression, simple fact and that will become more obvious when new sets with more stats become available. We literaly experienced that on live and back then bubble where worthless
PS When i speak about bubbles i mean these that comes from healers classes skills, not some fancy 3-4k bubble from morals