Daemonic Withering/Coordinated Fire - Undefendable/Reduced CD

[Orontes]

Spoiler:

Aside from a few posts that seem more informed by a class(es) animus, most seem to agree the current tactic is in a sorry state. Of the two proposed solutions, which would most prefer? If I had to choose, I think I would opt for Solution Two.

If someone holds animosity towards a class but presents a viable counterargument to the solutions proposed, it's not necessarily a bad thing. However, blind animosity is dealt with by the BMs and ultimately the GMs and lead dev. i.e. leave the policing to us. Cheers - Dan

[anarchypark]

you are talking about healer. is it little investment for slayer? or dps tank? any dps?



15% dmg amplify from all source is not a WB skill? hmmm 6man ST assist is not the only meaningful thing in the world.
i think i explained. skill is extremely good, drawback was not enough. after new mechanic drawback is enough.
you say drawback is too much, low it. i say no need it. hence 'magus don't need buff' comment.
blame my english.



i thought someone mentioned that no one take magus in WB.
it's stationary long range class. it's normal weak at moving battle.
it doesn't mean class need something

[Spierron]

just that if a change is made it concerns only a class and not two or more because a lot of class shares the same core tactic

engi has dodge(they have acces to -15% dodge/block/parry with tactic) magus has disrupt

with solution 1 both take advantage of it, is ok but only application is undefendable not damage after (stealth break on damage, don't forget please )

with solution 2 insane buff for Engi because low dodge, every switch u can give +15%damage on target and Magus will always be so disrupted but have more chance to apply this.

I play engi and run with Coordinated Fire and work properly, we have a long cd so use at the right time to buff the assist and help to kill a target quickly, tried on Magus and yes i agree with u is bad, low chance to apply this but the problem comes from disrupt and not from tactic if it works on Engi.

I like solution 1 because both take advantage.

[Bozzax]

1) (undef) simply isnt a wow for st dot with 20s cd where a grouped player is clnsd every 2.5s (or more).

20s cd abilities are near meaningless in grp play when playing weakest link (manic obsess etc just dont work).

[footpatrol2]

I think the tactic is fine how it is. If the tactic makes the dot undefendable then the tactic becomes a must have for heavy havoc/sniper tree builds which is not what we want to have. Right now the cost to the tactic is that you may get disrupted/dodged or may not. It's a risk.

Increasing the power of this tactic makes the other tactic's that are fighting for a slot less important and pushes this to be more important. This tactic is already fairly powerful.

I can kinda agree with solution 2. Not with solution 1. Although I don't think there is a issue with the tactic to begin with and don't think it really needs to be changed.

[wachlarz]

We want to increase the importance of tactics and skills to mark highly valued targets. Heals are these goals. Due to their high disrupt and willpower, it will be hard to apply to them. Tankers are not attacked either at the end, with classes dps somehow can be dealt with. Reducing the time will affect more dps (smaller dis) than helers (I will prefer to apply dot for two dpsow than constantly dis on one healer). Making a skill with undefendable will force magus / engi to choose your cherished targets

[wachlarz]

I think the tactic is fine how it is. If the tactic makes the dot undefendable then the tactic becomes a must have for heavy havoc/sniper tree builds which is not what we want to have. Right now the cost to the tactic is that you may get disrupted/dodged or may not. It's a risk.

The fight starts (first sec), I use the skil which does not work (dis), first it does not cause any damage, secondly I did not mark the target at + 15%. I have to wait another 20 sec to use my skill. How long do you fight? I think after 40 sec, it will be a long time after the fight end. Thirdly, as soon as I succeed, it will be cleaned up by the healer

[peterthepan3]

you are talking about healer. is it little investment for slayer? or dps tank? any dps?

The archetype used has no relevance whatsoever. The fact of the matter is that, should a player spec accordingly (20 RR is a small investment in the grand scheme of things), they can neuter the tactic quite considerably.

15% dmg amplify from all source is not a WB skill? hmmm 6man ST assist is not the only meaningful thing in the world.
i think i explained. skill is extremely good, drawback was not enough. after new mechanic drawback is enough.
you say drawback is too much, low it. i say no need it. hence 'magus don't need buff' comment.
blame my english.

So having to waste an entire tactic slot for one DoT that can be defended and cleansed, and is on a 20 second CD, isn't a sufficient drawback. That seems sorta OTT to me.

i thought someone mentioned that no one take magus in WB.
it's stationary long range class. it's normal weak at moving battle.
it doesn't mean class need something.

You take the Magus in a WB as a Rifter, i.e. it has a role. However, do you take a Magus in a group? Therein lies the issue, and what prompted the proposal.

15% damage in a WB environment doesn't make sense given: a) you are a Riftbot as a Magus, which mandates taking tactics that facilitate to this role; b) you will be part of a PBAOE/AoE support group; c) 15% damage on one target in a WB environment doesn't warrant taking when your whole purpose in a WB is to AoE down as many enemies as possible, in as short a time as possible

[Bozzax]

Spoiler:

The fact these DPS lack a hdebuff alone is reason enough to warrant a cleansable +15% damage debuff on 5s CD

No it isn't. Leave the ludicrous oversimplifications at home - Dan

[Renork]

I think the tactic is fine how it is. If the tactic makes the dot undefendable then the tactic becomes a must have for heavy havoc/sniper tree builds which is not what we want to have. Right now the cost to the tactic is that you may get disrupted/dodged or may not. It's a risk.

Increasing the power of this tactic makes the other tactic's that are fighting for a slot less important and pushes this to be more important. This tactic is already fairly powerful.

I can kinda agree with solution 2. Not with solution 1. Although I don't think there is a issue with the tactic to begin with and don't think it really needs to be changed.

DS is a must have tactic (and always has been) unless you're rifting and as peter stated, it has a lot of drawbacks (long CD, high disrupt, cleanse, requires tactic slot). If you are going to say "oh the class doesn't need it", at least have the decency to explain why the class doesn't need it. What exactly are the pro's you are presenting to counter the argument provided? Based on the responses one can easily infer a lot of people posting here do not play the class.