Return of Reckoning

Well, that much crit mattered little when your attacks did like 200 damage on an unguarded sorc trying to push through the gates. Essentially chaining one stacking M4 after another or both together could and did deny a crucial objective. CS was pretty much a must have even without 2h and I bet it still is.

Bretin wrote:

Tesq wrote:sure a 25% single target WE need to debuff every member of a bomb wb

finally the last forum god appeared: not every member in a bomb group bombs, think about it.

Tesq wrote:while all your PASSIVE tactics are 100% time in function and you just need to push for win a wb vs wb fight?

"all" includes the tactic LS which is a part of the discussion and which works like CS m8, RNG! so your point is BS - get gud.

i hardly find your answer arguments.

1-"not every member in a group" which mean every dps which mean 8 ppl and of course i should have 1 WE that pass all his time to move from dps to dps trying to debuff? buff/debuff is a tank work not a dps work, that's just a bad place to have a debuff and also it remove a tactic...just better bomb aoe and send a WE to take down 1 order healer from behind.

2- LS is not even an argument
1rst it dont buff the user
2nd it's easier crit with a dps classes rather than chosen
3rd point if CS (and i hardly belive it) is LS counter we dont have a counter for so much of your other crit stack

You just use LS cuz you have a *** broken undefitable aoe with slayer so you give him a 35% crit chance (+ 5% from sov + 10% from renow = 50% crit chance + ID + shatter limbs + rampge ) and go wreck anything -->GG well played.

@cripple strike would be relevant if the reduction stack proportionally with challenge

25% of 50% = 50 : 100 x 25= 12.5%

50% + 12.5% = 62.5%

And even in this way is hard as hell to apply it on every dps in the enemy wb. Instead all order buff to crit etc are all PASSIVE ....awsome.

what about change cripple strike to a 20% PASSIVE chance to proc rather than semi active with crit? but i image you want easy passive shiny tools only for orders

Penril wrote:

Azarael wrote:It modifies Envenomed Blade, which is typed as standard buff. It will not currently stack.

@Bretin: So be it. In light of this, should it be allowed to stack with CtW?

I believe it should. Think about it:

- KotBS + SW = effective buff of 35% to crit for the whole group.
- BG + WE = effective debuff of 30-45% (depends on how much hate the BG has) for ONE target. Can't be spammed since CtW has a 5 sec CD. So even if the WE goes from target to target, best she will get is 25/45/25/45/25/45 (after several GCDs).

And of course, both EB and CtW can be cleansed.

edit: Also, WE loses dps if using this tactic.

even doing this it would only results in 2 destru wb member in need to apply debuff to x 8 ppl while other wb simply spam dps CUZ all their stuff are passive.

IF passive---> it must be worst than active

THIS simple rule is totally missing from this game, we have order with passive /group and strong buff all that stack with each other and destru with ST /active and not well synery buff/debuff.

All of this even with out count that destru dont really have any counter for +20% crit chance from kobs that is not alone and it need to add to crit from gear and renow. Which became a base 20% and this also apply for heals as well since a 10% of that crit also boost heals.

SO every order party go around with a +20% crit chance and a+20% healing crit chance while a destru party have a 10% healing crit chance

The only real balance for order/destru would moveup in every path all the kobs tactics so that

1) they cannot be taken togheter in x3
2)none of these gamebreaking tactic can be takenin t2
3) no more than one in t3
4)max 2x in t4

then a nerf need to occure

1) the 2x buff to both damage and heal must go , only damage need to be buff or 2) either buff both for a 5% ; so 5%+5% and not 10%+10% (healer all have a base 10% crit chance so have a destru with 10 and order with 15 its k, but not 10% vs 20% camon..... In t2 that tactic was so broken )

Scrilian wrote:Well, that much crit mattered little when your attacks did like 200 damage on an unguarded sorc trying to push through the gates. Essentially chaining one stacking M4 after another or both together could and did deny a crucial objective. CS was pretty much a must have even without 2h and I bet it still is.

dok and chosen morals do not stack from long time, and

-chosen moral 4 mid path it's a crap cos you alredy cap every party member resistences with aura alone and since cap is at 40% you dont really reduces moral damages, that is different for armor but this is totally irrelevant vs bomb partys and anyway you may end with choppas with still low armor due the meccanic + enemys wep skill armor ingore

Base moral 4 can reduces MORALS damage and so it's better than mid path moral 4.

Offensive morals make wins the game in wb vs wb fight so you need m4 to couter those. And not a bland m4 30/60 second buff that you dont know WHEN use.

EDIT: also every serious healer use base moral 4 cos being able to ISTA ress all party member in a wb vs wb fight it's huge, also you may want use m1/m2 sometimes all this we use m4 stack to win the game is not relevant when order just need to push and dont need to wait for moral to build.


CS is a:

-meh skill
-on a meh path
-which also take tactic slot
-it require to crit
-on a class that from his realm get no passive and reliable 100% time up crit buff
-on a class that for his utility and self buff is TOTALLY dependand from tactics which make so hard choose those 2 not mandatory tactics.
-and for last but not least dont stack with challenge which it need to be always up since you have 8x tank and all must use shield. SO 4x tanks can use togheter hold the line + challenge while the other 4 use it when the that first ones end so basically

30/30 4x seconds challenge active WTF you need CS for?

Scrilian wrote:Well, that much crit mattered little when your attacks did like 200 damage on an unguarded sorc trying to push through the gates. Essentially chaining one stacking M4 after another or both together could and did deny a crucial objective. CS was pretty much a must have even without 2h and I bet it still is.

once again its an M4, an m4 that means your not using ID or alter fate along with restricting yourself from using your m1-3 and im pretty sure DoK cant build up morale as fast as a chosen with Destined For Victory to morale dump chain as soon as their m4 comes of CD like chosen can furthermore your not going to have all of this built up and ready to go at the start of a fight while order already has their crit chance

cs which you have to hope that you can debuff with rng, you missed me on blorc is far more consistent than CS at procing to use on what ever target you want thanks to guard

none of these 3 justify free almost 100% up time 20% group crit chance and heal crit chance and then some with LS and AF

TenTonHammer wrote:

Scrilian wrote: none of these 3 justify free almost 100% up time 20% group crit chance and heal crit chance and then some with LS and AF

And on that I'll disagree.

Tesq wrote:

Scrilian wrote:Well, that much crit mattered little when your attacks did like 200 damage on an unguarded sorc trying to push through the gates. Essentially chaining one stacking M4 after another or both together could and did deny a crucial objective. CS was pretty much a must have even without 2h and I bet it still is.

chosen moral 4 mid path it's a crap

30 seconds of a zealot having armor levels of a chosen with undeniable resist cap, you kinda lost me there bud

Scrilian wrote:

Tesq wrote:

Scrilian wrote:Well, that much crit mattered little when your attacks did like 200 damage on an unguarded sorc trying to push through the gates. Essentially chaining one stacking M4 after another or both together could and did deny a crucial objective. CS was pretty much a must have even without 2h and I bet it still is.

chosen moral 4 mid path it's a crap

30 seconds of a zealot having armor levels of a chosen with undeniable resist cap, you kinda lost me there bud

order cannot debuff elemental resistence aoe for the total of aura buff so that buff would just make you reduces 55-60% cap resistence which mean
total of 46,xx % damage reduction.
We alredy have 40% wtf we need 46% so?
Ye that moral is a crap. And you never know in which situation use it which make it unreliable and enemy wb can easily predict when you will be also with out. (which mean enemy wb have 30 sec of no buff to push what they want how they want)

I alredy have for base undeniable resistence debuff vs ST debuff and auras prove alredy for base almost undeniable resistence value vs aoe damage of BW (differently for order where magus can debuff sorc damage.)

This moral is a not needed surpluss if you didn't play at least once in very good RVR guild with bring wbs every rvr night don't comment.

I always wondered how people keep up challenge in a blobfight.
Never seen a tank running out, challenging and waiting patiently for 15s out of ae range.

Any pieces of advice?

Nanji wrote:I always wondered how people keep up challenge in a blobfight.
Never seen a tank running out, challenging and waiting patiently for 15s out of ae range.

Any pieces of advice?

4x tanks in a WB + shield + stack defense + hold the line when needed + every 15 seconds

it should be enough i think

Tesq wrote:

Nanji wrote:I always wondered how people keep up challenge in a blobfight.
Never seen a tank running out, challenging and waiting patiently for 15s out of ae range.

Any pieces of advice?

4x tanks in a WB + shield + stack defense + hold the line when needed + every 15 seconds

it should be enough i think

So we are disrupting ID now are we?