Return of Reckoning

Mez wrote:I just don't understand why you are proposing radical new mechanics when clearly of the 10,000 changes to the classes combustion was never looked at. You are suggesting untested patching rather than a straight restoration project.

Hm, why was there no fix for most of the high elf classes (sm, am, wl) in 5 years from the devs (as it is not rocket science to realize, that they are clearly inferior to their counterparts)?
Also i don't think, that there will be any big alterations to the game until it's finished. And even then there will be polls and such. This is just a discussion about pro and contra of a change and maybe the "pro-change faction" is completely wrong. But i can see barely any profound counterargumets, except "never touch a running(?) system".

The idea of not touching balance in a game famous for lack of balance and one of the main reasons its now dead. Well...

Luth wrote:

Mez wrote:I just don't understand why you are proposing radical new mechanics when clearly of the 10,000 changes to the classes combustion was never looked at. You are suggesting untested patching rather than a straight restoration project.

Hm, why was there no fix for most of the high elf classes (sm, am, wl) in 5 years from the devs (as it is not rocket science to realize, that they are clearly inferior to their counterparts)?

I give you the SM, maybe the WL, even if i remember how broken the pet fetch was for a long time and how mad we mae people fishing them from their warcamp.

But the only point i ever recall my AM being bad was at the start of the game where i would have to beg for guards on t2 scenarios or melt in 3 secs from Witches jumping me from stealth.

bloodi wrote: But the only point i ever recall my AM being bad was at the start of the game where i would have to beg for guards on t2 scenarios or melt in 3 secs from Witches jumping me from stealth.

AM are amazeballs at the start of the game. Its end game with no heal on move that they really suffer.

Telen wrote:

Sulorie wrote: I spec this to counter MDPS with crit tactic. Sorc/Bw is just detaunt and cleanse.

Dont ask my am for a cleanse.

Also other rdps have to deal with detaunt only they have far less damage.

And they are far less depended on healers.

Telen wrote:AM are amazeballs at the start of the game. Its end game with no heal on move that they really suffer.

What i mean with the start of the game, is near release, not the first levels. Witches were really strong near release and got hit with the nerfbat not long after it.

And the lack of heal on move was not that big of a deal, he could compensate it really well with the silences, aoe snare, pushback that other healers didnt even have.

I reached rank 70 am mostly roaming, never had a problem or felt thaht i had to change to WP/RM but maybe its because i really really like the am gameplay.

Sulorie wrote:

Luth wrote:

Penril wrote:Tbh i don't know why people complain about Sorcs/BWs. They were OP the first year or 2, but they were definitely not a threat in 1.4.8 .

You definetely need to spend 45 renown points in "trivial blows" to be somewhat secure from being killed in 10 seconds against any late game bw/sorc.

I spec this to counter MDPS with crit tactic. Sorc/Bw is just detaunt and cleanse.

I'm 100% sure that the extra damage from "critdamage increase tactics" was not affected by trivial blows.
Some healers have their cleanse on cooldown, or the bw/sorc debuffs are "hidden" under a shitload of other debuffs. Or there is more then one sorc/bw. In the worst case they assist each other.

Independant from this, the devs said in a Q&A, that it is bad game design that you have to spec 45 renown points to survive the rotation of a class.

bloodi wrote: I give you the SM, maybe the WL, even if i remember how broken the pet fetch was for a long time and how mad we mae people fishing them from their warcamp.

But the only point i ever recall my AM being bad was at the start of the game where i would have to beg for guards on t2 scenarios or melt in 3 secs from Witches jumping me from stealth.

The AM is the worst endgame healer, but my post was meant to compare it with the counterpart (shaman: speedbuff, autodetaunt tactic etc.)

Sulorie wrote:

Telen wrote:

Sulorie wrote: I spec this to counter MDPS with crit tactic. Sorc/Bw is just detaunt and cleanse.

Dont ask my am for a cleanse.

Also other rdps have to deal with detaunt only they have far less damage.

And they are far less depended on healers.

True. But in organized groups there is no lack of heals. Also: Removal of the selfdamage = no dependece on healers when playing solo.

Sulorie wrote: And they are far less depended on healers.

So that they dont perform as well out of groups should be a factor in a game that is build around that gameplay.
Heal debuff change would help them it that respect making them more balanced out of group anyway.
Also as you noted cleansing bw/sorc was mandatory. That Am/Shaman couldnt had a knockon effect to healer balance.