Disrupt vs magical class, nerf/boost classes or rework disrupt in general?

[footpatrol2]

Current mechanic's are fine.

If anything split up deft defender so you don't get both dodge and disrupt with a single renown point buy of deft defender.

Example:
Make deft defender only increase disrupt at the current rates but not dodge.
Make trivial blows (<--- only because it is unused atm, could be anything...) increase dodge at the (old) deft defender rate.

Right now it costs 20 renown points to increase your dodge and disrupt by 18%. It is full protection against ranged.

By splitting up disrupt AND dodge from deft defender your effectively making it so it will cost double the renown points to get the same effect.

Old (current) system
20 renown points of deft defender gives = 18% dodge and disrupt
Total renown spent old (current) system = 20 points

Under new suggested system
20 renown points of deft defender gives = 18% disrupt
20 renown points of (insert name(trivial blows)) gives = 18% dodge
Total renown spent new system = 40 renown points

Btw... this is how it used to be under the old renown rank system.

What I'm suggesting is a rollback and it is a easier pill for the community to swallow and won't be a shock to the community so you'll have diminished population swings in transition.

[rmpl]

Current mechanic's are fine.

If anything split up deft defender so you don't get both dodge and disrupt with a single renown point buy of deft defender.

Example:
Make deft defender only increase disrupt at the current rates but not dodge.
Make trivial blows (<--- only because it is unused atm, could be anything...) increase dodge at the (old) deft defender rate.

Right now it costs 20 renown points to increase your dodge and disrupt by 18%. It is full protection against ranged.

By splitting up disrupt AND dodge from deft defender your effectively making it so it will cost double the renown points to get the same effect.

Old (current) system
20 renown points of deft defender gives = 18% dodge and disrupt
Total renown spent old (current) system = 20 points

Under new suggested system
20 renown points of deft defender gives = 18% disrupt
20 renown points of (insert name(trivial blows)) gives = 18% dodge
Total renown spent new system = 40 renown points

Btw... this is how it used to be under the old renown rank system.

What I'm suggesting is a rollback and it is a easier pill for the community to swallow and won't be a shock to the community so you'll have diminished population swings in transition.

Wouldn't people still choose to spec 18% disrupt over 18% dodge anyway? I know I would.

[Nabaro]

We have rdd meta, Even dot change did not stop ppl play rdd. But instead of playing for a melee fighter, players are asked to nerf dodg\disrupt. Disrupt it's okay, just mdd and the healers are so afraid enemy rdd that they put rr in the dodge\disrupt. Do not break that is not broken. When mdd meta comes, everyone will begin take parrying and the rdd will shine. So we nerf it too?

Who really suffered from disrupt is my heal shamy, but it only shaman problems, rip.

[Tamarlan]

Something crazy ... leave it like it is. Life is still dangerous enough as a cloth-wearing healer.

[Valfaros]

Crazy thoughts. Go nuts they said.

Initiative now does
+ dodge and disrupt avoidance
+ crit reduction
+ stealth stuff

Willpower now does
+ healing power
+ disrupt strikethrough (same rate as INT)

This would make init a way better defensive stat than it is now but base/armor values for init differ by a large margin as we have already seen in a prior post. If you guys reevaluate the base values/bringing them in line then I'd say this is a good idea but currently this will change a lot of classes in different ways.
Example dps dok currently has with dominator about 126 base init but atleast he has higher willpower. Now if you change the deffensive nature off wp to init you change the balance of said class. Since disrupt strikethrough is a useless stat for dok but disrupt is not. Even if we say most of the disrupt is revoked by intel, it still helps e.g. rp stagger.
Note:+Init debuffs is a thing esp. with the current armor that basically make you 100% crittable if you don't spec crazy for it (meele sw...). I wouldn't want them to also debuff my disrupt. But hey if you bring the base stats in line across the board why not give it a try.

Here another small thing to think of; lets say I'm capping intel with my dps zealot and want to go for more disrupt strikethrough with willpower. Here is the problem I can't since zealots mechanic is transforming the willpower into more intel.

[Aurandilaz]

What about tweaks:
-Decrease HTL aoe buff from 15 to 10% Disrupt/Dodge (so no more +45 stack but max 30) (helps in largescale)
-Add extra side effect to Taunt, target loses focus and suffers -10% Disrupt/Dodge (helps in smallscale)
-Staff(+charm) grants +8%/10% Disrupt strikethrough value, same way current 2hander weapons have Block strikethrough
-Mirror StrikeThrough tactics from Order to Destro as way of achieving BALANCE (not like I wrote a long and detailed proposal about 4 weeks ago to get BurnThrough-like tactic to Sorc...) (get also something nice from AM to shaman to close the balance between those 2 dmg potential)

To counter above:
Combined Initiative and Willpower into one "defensive stat" pool, add the numbers together Init+WP/2=Disrupt+Dodge values.
Meaning, if currently healer gets 800 Willpower and Disrupt from that for some value (maybe +32? assuming 4 Disrupt per 100sh WP? dont remember correct rate), under the "aggregated defensive value gain" a healer with say 800 WP and 300 Init would have a pool of 1100, divided into two 550s, resulting in now Disrupt gained from just 550 (so maybe down to +22 Disrupt gained from WP) - but now having more Dodge and realistic chances of Dodging on a healer.
It would place further value into Initiative, making possible more classes run specs with Init investments as you need both WP and Init to get a decent defence rate against rdps of both types, without heavily just countering magical but physical as well.

And because this hopefully makes magic dpsing more viable, potentially raise Resistance caps from 40% to 50% or even 60%.


Currently it is very much "unfun" to play a class where your dmg is based on RNG on whether your burst and DoTs actually land at all. To counter this RNG you just end spamming AoE that doesn't require main target meaning you divided the risks and possibly just stopped using certain target requiring abilities (Sorc Shattered Shadows + Black Horror borderline unusable, can hit immobile oil but nigh impossible to pull off in warband vs warband action due to long cast time and aoe providing set backs and inherent risk of having to pass through primary RNG check before doing bunch of 2ndary RNG checks - BW can do 0 sec FieryBlast which makes it somewhat tolerable since you dont need to waste 3 seconds standing still under AoE pressure). (same issue with 0 sec Fireball vs 3 sec Doombolt - standing still for 3 sec and not having tactic like BurnThrough - one could say it is somewhat imbalanced in favour of one side currently - result; just forget you even have Doombolt in your hotbar)
It's probably even worse for magical caster without spammable AoE that decreases the risk that RNG keeps providing to you as a challenge.

[footpatrol2]

We live in a rdd meta BECAUSE hold the line wasn't working forever on this server and player's/RoR community have grown accustomed to hold the line not working.

This has a 2 fold effect.
The actual player's playing rdd classes felt more powerful then they ever should have.
Tanks have access to HTL didn't use it because it wasn't that effective.

Now HTL is effective. But the RoR community is slow to adapt. You still have all those player's that rolled rdd classes that are pisst that they can't destroy like they used too but... they never were suppose to be that powerful.

I still don't see highly coordinated HTL group comps (aside from keeps). You can shut down Rdd meta atm but it requires organization/coordination/discipline/trust/teamwork to do so.

Physical damage has to deal with armor. Not all targets are ideal for physical damage like tanks...
Magic damage has to deal with disrupt. Not all targets are ideal for magic damage like healer's...

[dansari]

Physical damage has to deal with armor. Not all targets are ideal for physical damage like tanks...
Magic damage has to deal with disrupt. Not all targets are ideal for magic damage like healer's...

OK, but tanks are meant to mitigate damage. Healers are not. Currently healer disrupt is overperforming.

[footpatrol2]

No it is not overperforming. It is where it is suppose to be.

[catholicism198]

To you guys saying that you should just split Disrupt/Dodge... splitting the two will not accomplish a single thing- all it will do is buff non-magic rdps. given the choice, people are still going stack disrupt. nothing will change for magic based rdps. endless "disrupt"s is still all you will see.