Sever1n wrote: Sat Jan 24, 2026 2:01 pm
Check balance proposals. I did long explanation why.
You mean your wishlists? If those are "explanations" then, yeah, ive seen those threads
https://www.returnofreckoning.com/forum ... 83#p589983
https://www.returnofreckoning.com/forum ... 92#p589992
It contains no analyzes of any kind, no data and you dont count in variety of compositions, environments of game modes. You also stay silent in terms of how your wishes will affect gameplay on different levels. So my question "why BG need buffs" still stands, nothing in your wishlist shreds a light into this blind (imo) spot.
yoluigi wrote: Sat Jan 24, 2026 3:42 pm
I would not bother with Nocturnal he just trolling. Everbody know's BG need more buff for single target dmg abilities and they dont bring the quality buff like IB gives. Sure people play because it's a fun class to play but Chosen/BO require less skill and bring more to the table.
Yeah, but to an extent. Everybody knows is no argument. Im plain serious about channel tho, its incredibly dull to propose such change, especially assuming how process of balancing here goes. Also no DPS buff will come without a cost, be careful what you wish for.
Deadpoet wrote: Sun Jan 25, 2026 12:42 pm
This.
There are people who usually oppose any suggestion of changes by default and they convince themselves that they do it based on logic and experience and common sense. It's easy, one can find arguments for anything. Nocturnal appears to me to fall in that category. His incongruous mixture of seemingly peaceful and sensible reasoning with sudden aggressive know-it-all sarcasm is quite unique though.
I dont oppose any suggestion of changes, i oppose those that were mentioned here in general and a channel in particular. As for the last part, i just happen to be triggered by something and if it aligns with spare time i have - i type. Also im not seemingly peaceful, i usually just adapt to a tone of whoever im talking to. Also if conversation is full of well-thought out analyse, data, considers many factors i will always keep it respectful, civil, aknowledge my mistakes etc. But, yeah, its gonna be a bit different if person just randomly mash buttons on keyboard not putting a glimpse of effort to think before posting.
So now into details a little bit. But at first
Farrul wrote: Mon Jan 26, 2026 11:29 am
5 pages debate over a small little buff (which is well deserved). Christ just give BG a dps buff to the channel since it was clearly overnerfed and hits like a wet noodle now.
It's just like the KOTBS discussion, people were arguing that a KOTBS dps buff would be a huge thin, then devs buffed Myrmidas fury more than we asked for and it proved to be completely within balance, not a problem at all.
The drama of this forum!
P.S. hopefully the 2H IB will be looked at as well, it sucks.(not channel, generally) .
Yes, i remember that discussion very clearly, mine and your points. Was a good one. It got armor penetration, but what in reality happened at competetive level is that kotbs got group armor buff, what we pinpoint back then as a biggest problem (being a hostage of 1 spec) still stands pretty much. You will not afford it anyhow, only possible if you do 6v6 and build around destroy confidence and got another KD on DPS. Kotbs change opened up possibility for people to clip fancy-schmancy solo adventures, yes. Everyone happy now? Cool if so, but i feel no relief yet. Where will you go with that channel? Pugging SCs, topping scoreboards? Was that what i said back then? See what happened now?
(killboard is buggy for me atm, ill add or post later tons of useless DPS kotbs topping scoreboards literally throwing matches for their teams with a score of 0 kills - 20+ for enemy team) I wish to believe i dont have to explain this exact part, but if its unclear dont hesistate to quote me back.
And like i said back then, all this was already possible to an extent. Due to potions stack now any tank can even further reliably go fully offensive and dish out "numbers". Hugest buff kotbs/chosen got is on demand absorb with insane value, so now they are a bit more tough if build as glass (why even do that, very weird reasons i note). Did it gain actual kill power after all this changes? No.
And yes, this applies into BG as well, it can also go very offensive gearwise, still take parry tactic, and also dish out numbers. Wont match biggest fluffers (kotbs/chosen), but gonna be very close. Why do that? No reasons.
This strong will to smash things with big 2h stick is not beyond me tho, but to make it somewhat balanced we need way more efforts put into game mechanics and prolly better to do it dividing roles more strictly, e.g. no guard/challenge for DPS. Same in ideal world should be done with healers. Other options blur things way too much, there will still be options to tank and fluff 1,1-2 million of dmg in proper city. I strongly believe we need less of such "cases" (defWE
) not more.
Culexus wrote: Sun Jan 25, 2026 12:46 pm
I'd like to see BG buffed to lean more heavily into its niche of being the best debuff/cc tank rather than the generic route of more damage. Changing its requirements to have to spec high crit to make its abilities work would be a start. Especially since RoR has 1000 ways to reduce crit and crit damage compared to gaining crit and Knight can do the same debuffs without requiring it.
And this exact thought i share either. As i previously also mentioned (and Sever1n mentioned it too in his topics), the biggest issue at the moment is that for BG everything worthy is tied into crit. Current balance circle with lots of ini, abilities rework has made it totally unviable and something has to be done. inb4 BG could gear and run pretty offensively, reaching ~850 str in their most balanced specs, be tanky af and shine.
Its not the channel that is an issue, channel was all in one ability used to actively pump, it had absolutely insane scalers comparable with 13 point mastery channels being at 5 (summoning Sinisterror for an old webacrhive career builder
but for the general referance, i truly dont recall what patch it was, but likely current 1.4.8
https://builder.null/career/black-guard oh, and also, @Sever1n as you didnt understand what i refer to, take a look here how BG was design "originally"), which was simply an "overlook" when Torque remade the class (his main class may i note), because he couldnt win duels in gud ol' days. So 5pt mastery channel nerf is very justified in reality, it fixed an abomination Torque made.
Maybe indeed, a bit of mirroring would help, with some additional hate tied buff into ini/ws, as Florian mentioned. Or all at once, untie HD of crit (kotbs mirror), put st WS self/DP buff into PS and add ini into ET. Could be a nice start imo. If channel to be changed, then it needs a nerf into amount of hits as the very minimum, so no more then 5 hits.
But BGs damage is not an issue of a class. It, like any other tank already have options to fluff scoreboards if one wish so. Making changes so BG will fluff easier and better is literally a waste of devs/balance team time.
P.S. Before we further go into channel discussion if anyone wish to do so, be sure to be confident with data of all 6 of them at least on ability viewer levels.
) not more.