Wanting to play BG

[footpatrol2]

@jaycub

Was that warband comment to me? I wasn't talking about warbands. I was talking about how 2 bg's and 2 dok's in a 6 man could work and synergize.

[Penril]

Big brawlin is huge too, unless you removed it along with slice through BO will always be mandatory. BG aoe snare doesnt have near the uptime and is group cleansed by WP. BO aoe snare is uncleanseable.

Yes it is huge. But again, is it because BO is way better than BG? Or is it because WP can't cleanse the BO, and Dok can't cleanse KotBS who also has an AoE snare?

In my eyes, it is not that BO>BG. It just happens that Dok/WP/KotBs MAKE the BO a better choice than BG. And that's because those 3 classes are the strongest in their archetype groups and pretty much mandatory. I would fix those 3 classes first before I buffed any other class.

Don't think making it group cleansable would help, would just hurt knight a bit more. BO has no CD on AoE snare (restricted only to stance dancing), doesnt require a target either. Very easily reapplied after it's grouped cleansed and actually might even be considered a buff to make it cleansable as it's more fodder that is easily reapplied that now the WP is cleansing through.

You are right on this. Good point.

[Eathisword]

Man oh man. There is no theoretical reason to pick a BG over BO/ch. But there is a reason to pick a good BG over the 100s of bad BO and chosen.

That being said : in designing build, I like to think about it from a numerical pov. Hence, there is no way I would give up Terrifying Foe in any build design (except a FO loldps joke). At 40, in ruin gear or better, it is a 200-300 toughness increase tactic. There is no freaking tactic in the game that give anything as huge as this one stats wise. It frees up a tactic (rugged), jewels, talisman, gear, renown point, potion to get more offense, more parry and more resist. You could run full merc and still reach 800-900 toughness easily.

About 2h vs SnB : I think you underestimate the damage gained from using a 2H by a lot. I dont have the math, but in my tests, it cuts your overall damage output by something around 30%+. It is different than SM/BO/CH because they can rely heavily on spirit/corp attack + procs to get their damage. IB/BG is all physical and a big chunk of it is your AA. So you trade KD for 30% damage.

Concerning parry : You can easily reach 40-45% parry and 30-35% dodge/disrupt without slotting ADM, thanks to the epic weapon proc. In my experience, it is enough to keep you out of trouble.

I would definitely play 2h BG (I do play mine sometimes). IMO, outside of cave-win, it is just as good and fun as IB, it is tougher and it can do more damage.

Zerg bust build : This waronlinebuilder.org - Black Guard build or that waronlinebuilder.org - Black Guard build
Scenario build : waronlinebuilder.org - Black Guard build Can Swap EB for Hastened doom or Choking fury, depends on team comp.
Solo build : waronlinebuilder.org - Black Guard build

[TenTonHammer]

The only reason SnB BO is better than BG is because of morale pump, agreed on that. Otherwise they are pretty balanced.

Superior due to stat steal or did i miss that meta shift and it is no longer a factor in T4?

It was never the stat steal; it was only the Initiative steal. It was incredibly OP in T2 since it increased your target's chance to be crit to around 300% (NOT by 300%... TO 300%). Much less so in T3 because the increase was around 25%. Now in T4 and with people running Annihilator/Mercenary, it isn't OP anymore. Go and test it for yourself, hit a friend with it and check how much his chance to be crit got increased. It won't be more than 20%, which is something a KotBS has on 24/7 while the BO has to wait for a proc (and to have that specific stat stolen). Strong? Oh yeah, it definitely is still strong. Just not OP anymore.

Use this calculator if you want. Check how much your chance to be crit increases at lvl 20 and at lvl 40 if you lose around 100 Initiative.

https://tools.idrinth.de/tank/?a0l=40&d ... 0pm=0&dN=0

At level 26, I was able to reduce the Initiative of a well-geared mara to 8. That meant a 306% chance to be crit. At lvl 40, it is pretty much impossible to reduce someone's Initiative to zero.

So on the order side on things hows IB then?

Still SM > IB or like BG and BO they are equal?

[Penril]

I didnt'say BO was equal with BG. BO is in a better position atm, but BG is not as bad as some people claim, and it can be quite good in the right hands.

Same thing on Order I guess. Only tanks who are completely mandatory are Chosen/KotBS.

[Older]

6 months easymode BO should learn u something before u take it to the next lvl as masophist BG gl.

[Jaycub]

Why play Blackguard.......

You better spill the deets of where you can get those appearances :^)

[TenTonHammer]

I dont like how the axe part of the glaives get smaller and smaller with each "higher tier" upgrade it gets less and less threatening

[Older]

why u posting apperance he cant even get a the current state, without 70parry and 40+ dis/dodge dont even think about wearing gliave so to 60rr + is needed gl.

[Jaycub]

Anyone else feel like or notice that BG punt is much harder to pull off in terms of getting your target to go in the direction you want compared to knight/ch?

I am going through the exact same motions on BG in terms of punting mechanics as I did on knight (the last class I played fresh in my mind/memory) yet I get different results and feel like there is some kind of huge fudge factor or something with the punt.

On knight snaring someone while I was not snared, getting 5 feet behind them and punting worked nearly 100% of the time, yet it hardly ever works on BG, always seem to veer left/right by a large degree. I mean I guess i could blow KD on someone to guarantee it, but when you shouldnt have to it's a major waste.