Return of Reckoning

Release the ram Oil siege weapon and fix the bugged door and it will be more fun to def against both whitout to switch faction when you are really outnumbered

As i said before in this thread, and when warhamer released in 2008 i said the same, i was confused then as well, wth did mythic vreate a 2 sided rvr game, when everyone knows a 3 sided rvr game works better, the real issue is the game is only 2 sided, i`m just waiting on unchained to launch really . theres not to much you can do to really fix the problem.

breaking up the existing 6 races into 3 seperate factions, may be possible, but if you go by lore, it wouldn`t be high elfs and dark elfs on one faction,

they should have added a 3rd neutral faction, like Skaven, or undead, or Lizardmen etc, when the game released.

DirkDaring wrote:As i said before in this thread, and when warhamer released in 2008 i said the same, i was confused then as well, wth did mythic vreate a 2 sided rvr game, when everyone knows a 3 sided rvr game works better, the real issue is the game is only 2 sided, i`m just waiting on unchained to launch really . theres not to much you can do to really fix the problem.

breaking up the existing 6 races into 3 seperate factions, may be possible, but if you go by lore, it wouldn`t be high elfs and dark elfs on one faction,

they should have added a 3rd neutral faction, like Skaven, or undead, or Lizardmen etc, when the game released.

Read my previous posts on the subject, though I would give a kidney to play a Liche Priest. (Amenadresh was my favourite WoH character for a reason )

There are many-things that could be done if Gear Appearance wasn't a factor, but I have a feeling that most people wont want to play a character if there is no appearance progression: i.e Skaven Daemons etc. Even with WoH content and pulling skins off mobs, There would be like 2 or 3 armour sets for each of these "new" classes tops. The blood letter would only have variety in weapons. Would playing a Gutter Runner, warplock engineer, or Khorne Bloodletter as fleshed out classes be cool enough for people to stick with it?

I know personally once I get a certain appearance I like, I will rarely change...I think maybe if the new classes had unique elements and were cool in their own right people would play them.

Sulorie wrote:@Mez: I don't vote against xrealming, because it sounds like you want to convince me.
I just say that only a reworked rvr system would solve the problems we have.
People think that xrealming causes imbalance and they are wrong, because it's just a symptom, not the root cause. Sadly it happens quite often that people can't properly name the real issue, only because its symptoms are more apparent.

So take what I say with a grain of salt as I only played live for 1-2 months and have only been here ~ 1-2 months. That said, I have 3 30+ characters. 1 is RR40, the others are ~ RR30 on both Destro/Order.

I have been thinking of this Xrealming thing for a while. It happened most notably in a big keep defense on Order. We were fending them off on the Inner Door. Actually doing a great job. All the sudden about 10+ players logged off (not a disconnect as I have seen that happen too) and then out of nowhere Destro had more guys and overcame the keep.

Now, it could have been coincidence, but it felt like they knew were were eventually going under, instead of put up a fight , they logged to the winning side.


I read what Mez wrote, and I feel I am cut from the same cloth. I like to seek out AAO with a smaller warband and cause Havoc on the guys there. Maybe we just go from BO to BO and force them to re-cap over and over delaying the keep assault until we get more defenders. Or my favorite, waiting till they break a door, all melee rush in leaving healers outside unguarded and we have wrecked a warband before doing that.

Now that said (again), I have had a couple thoughts on this I wanted to throw out there for possible suggestions:

1) An -AAO.
I dont know if this is possible or not, but hypotehtically, it would put a -AAO on anyone who joins the zone AFTER a certain point. So say its 40 vs 15. A 6 man group joins a keep assault making it 46 vs 15.... Those 6 guys could get penalized with a -AAO giving them LESS influence/renown/exp. This would give even more incentive to play the defense OR maybe even just sit out - both of which would make for a more fair fight?

I think the possible trick to this would be to only have it impact the recent joiners, otherwise it wouldnt work.

2) Rather than "open up" Keeps/BOs based on time. Rather if X number of players are in the zone(s).
Again, dont know if this is possible or not, Keeps could still have a time requirement on how soon they would unlock, but after that time, they would only be available if an adequate sized defense were in the area - possible the same for BOs.

One advantage I think this system has, is there wouldnt be any "free-nown" and if a BO is available for capture, you know atleast X sized party is in the area, so watchout and be ready for a fight. You might also incoorpate system wide messages to announce this (like currently) XXX are available for capture - would let people know there is a fight going on, get ready to scrap! Rather than "hey its avaialble, but noone knows if there is any defense". If that makes sense.

3) Possible Que System?
Havnt thought this out all the way, just thought it might be possible to ADD the three RvR areas into the Que system so that it would "auto-join" aka Fly you to the zone if there was a fight going on. So you would "Que All" for PVP and you might see "Highpass RvR" pop and take it teleporting you to the WB (inside a WB) or maybe just the zone itself.

Just another way to get people to that area faster. I know there is some type of "rally call" system? Maybe this is that... Like I said, never played Live much and am new.



Those are just a few ideas I have had. Thoughts?

Realm Pride: This concept made the old game amazing in my opinion. I think there is still a heavy presence of realm pride.


as for x realmers there are certainly a number of people (and most of us know who they are) that actively x realm for the sake of Boosting the Underdog (yay) and a handful that do it to completely crush the side they were failing to defend lol

I wont name the names, but we had that happen before, my guild was defending a keep, and a couple of recognizable names who play both sides suddenly left and logged onto the other side and tipped the scales to order's favor. Why tip the scales for a rather pointless keep take escapes me.

Didn't seem to happen very often, but now with Loot bags Im going to take the likely assumption that it will happen more often moving forward.

StormX2 wrote:Realm Pride: This concept made the old game amazing in my opinion. I think there is still a heavy presence of realm pride.


as for x realmers there are certainly a number of people (and most of us know who they are) that actively x realm for the sake of Boosting the Underdog (yay) and a handful that do it to completely crush the side they were failing to defend lol

I wont name the names, but we had that happen before, my guild was defending a keep, and a couple of recognizable names who play both sides suddenly left and logged onto the other side and tipped the scales to order's favor. Why tip the scales for a rather pointless keep take escapes me.

Didn't seem to happen very often, but now with Loot bags Im going to take the likely assumption that it will happen more often moving forward.

Do you think increased rewards for defense ticks would help this?

th3gatekeeper wrote:

StormX2 wrote:Realm Pride: This concept made the old game amazing in my opinion. I think there is still a heavy presence of realm pride.


as for x realmers there are certainly a number of people (and most of us know who they are) that actively x realm for the sake of Boosting the Underdog (yay) and a handful that do it to completely crush the side they were failing to defend lol

I wont name the names, but we had that happen before, my guild was defending a keep, and a couple of recognizable names who play both sides suddenly left and logged onto the other side and tipped the scales to order's favor. Why tip the scales for a rather pointless keep take escapes me.

Didn't seem to happen very often, but now with Loot bags Im going to take the likely assumption that it will happen more often moving forward.

Do you think increased rewards for defense ticks would help this?

Defense rewarded bags as well on live, but the logic behind the rewards not being equal is that if defense reward=attack reward, both sides would rather just defend from the safety of their keep than risk attack.

yep and everyone loved a good keep defense that's for sure =)

Keep defense gives awesome rewards for a good one int he first place, so dont really see need for the loot bag =/

Tklees wrote:

th3gatekeeper wrote:

StormX2 wrote:Realm Pride: This concept made the old game amazing in my opinion. I think there is still a heavy presence of realm pride.


as for x realmers there are certainly a number of people (and most of us know who they are) that actively x realm for the sake of Boosting the Underdog (yay) and a handful that do it to completely crush the side they were failing to defend lol

I wont name the names, but we had that happen before, my guild was defending a keep, and a couple of recognizable names who play both sides suddenly left and logged onto the other side and tipped the scales to order's favor. Why tip the scales for a rather pointless keep take escapes me.

Didn't seem to happen very often, but now with Loot bags Im going to take the likely assumption that it will happen more often moving forward.

Do you think increased rewards for defense ticks would help this?

Defense rewarded bags as well on live, but the logic behind the rewards not being equal is that if defense reward=attack reward, both sides would rather just defend from the safety of their keep than risk attack.

Yeah, makes sense. Im curious what people think about some of my previous suggestions above? Are people in favor of adding "restrictions" on size/payout/availability of RVR in order to make them more balanced fights?

OR would this be too much and the simple "open world" idea is just better?

th3gatekeeper wrote:

Tklees wrote:

th3gatekeeper wrote:
Do you think increased rewards for defense ticks would help this?

Defense rewarded bags as well on live, but the logic behind the rewards not being equal is that if defense reward=attack reward, both sides would rather just defend from the safety of their keep than risk attack.

Yeah, makes sense. Im curious what people think about some of my previous suggestions above? Are people in favor of adding "restrictions" on size/payout/availability of RVR in order to make them more balanced fights?

OR would this be too much and the simple "open world" idea is just better?

Think about it this way. We have an elite 6 man who can handle 12-18 of your average players by themselves. Now with your que idea, the 6 man and 18 average players get in vs 24 average players. You would have the same "balance" issues you have in SCs now in RvR.

RvR is the core of this game because you can log in and just go into the lake and hopefully find a fight. No restrictions on entry, no wait, just pure PvP. What your suggestion would do is make a wait for PvP in all forms not just SCs and that is something that wouldnt be good for the game IMO