Successful RVR Tactics - How they are starting to kill the game

[tionblack]

I think what troubles you is the overpopulation,reverting rvr changes and seperating tiers would make you happy.

[Laurentz]

Thanks for adding precisely nothing to the conversation Hasty.

Tion, condensing the T2-T4 population all into one zone maybe does make it a little harder to solo since wherever you turn is more likely to be a wb or group coming around the corner to splatter you. In T1 there are typically two zones open simultaneously so it is easy to pick one and find some great small battles.

[Vayra]

If the game is balanced well at a smaller scale that should also translate to a balanced game on a grander scale,

No, this does not follow at all. The game might be perfectly balanced for 6v6, but if one side has more aoe damage or aoe buffs/debuffs they will be far stronger in 24v24 situations than the side with mostly single target. The fights also happen in a completely different way at larger scales. Small scale balance does in no way transfer over to large scale (and vise versa). The prevalence of bombing strats on live should tell you as much, they don't work in small scale, but in large scale where you can hit critical mass of PBAOE it became hugely successful.

[Laurentz]

These pull bomb groups are a product of us sitting in keep doorways for 50% of our time in orvr, they are not nearly as useful in open field orvr like we had more of at live. These are also partially a product of disrupt change (unbalancing the game), single target has been made less reliable for casters, forcing us to avoid targeting tanks and healers, which is annoying in zerg fighting. So just go aoe and you will hit something squishy. I've seen single target 6 mans work and pbaoe 6 mans work in small scale fighting. I've also seen single target WL 6 mans tearing through large numbers in zerg fighting. See how quickly a clothy vanishes into a fine red mist when triple pounced. The current style of keep siege has forced the pull bomb squad on us more than it being OP overall. Why does order seem to be doing it more frequently and more successfully than destro lately?

[lastalien]

Meet lags only when TUPs and tail (both) into the zone of battle.

Perhaps it makes sense to change Guild day randomly, what would the tail do not destroy the area because of lag

[Sedok]

It will always be like this until there is another 3 faction game.

A third faction won't solve anything and such a reason is used by people who choose to remain blissfully ignorant of the many nuances of WAR's decline. No game with three factions operates as their proponents claim, that if one side becomes dominant the other two can team up to defeat them; whether its DAoC, GW2, ESO, Planetside, or even Rift's Conquest mode, they all operate the same way. One faction dominates, the second tries their best to counter them, and the third becomes next to non-existent. This makes sense too, because if your goal is to pool manpower to defeat a superior opponent, why would you ever split that 50/50 right off the bat?

The most prominent issue with WAR's RvR system is keeping player's morale up, i.e. their will to fight. In theory, when things get tough, you either step up to the plate or loose. However, since this is a game on the internet, players have two additional options when faced with a challenge, log off and/or complain on the forums. Since its human nature to take the path of least resistance, guess which options people choose the most.

"300 moments" are what made me fall in love with this game; the ability for an organized guild to put in tens of hours of training, so that they can stop a "zerg" three, four, five, even six times their number, dead in its tracks. With the changes to WP and BW, we will no longer see something on the scale of <Eternal>'s 48 vs 301 hold of Thaugamond Massif on Vaul's Anvil, but RoR doesn't have 300-man "zergs" roaming the lacks; max I've seen for order is five warbands, that's 120 players, easily manageable with good terrain selection and good organization (and the hamster not having a heart-attack). It all depends on whether or not the players choose to "be change" as the saying goes, and put in the time and effort to halt the Order "zerg".

[Buling]

"300 moments" are what made me fall in love with this game; the ability for an organized guild to put in tens of hours of training, so that they can stop a "zerg" three, four, five, even six times their number, dead in its tracks. With the changes to WP and BW, we will no longer see something on the scale of <Eternal>'s 48 vs 301 hold of Thaugamond Massif on Vaul's Anvil, but RoR doesn't have 300-man "zergs" roaming the lacks; max I've seen for order is five warbands, that's 120 players, easily manageable with good terrain selection and good organization (and the hamster not having a heart-attack). It all depends on whether or not the players choose to "be change" as the saying goes, and put in the time and effort to halt the Order "zerg".

Unfortunately those are very rare. Very Very rare.

This server doesn't have the long term community (simply because it's one server and as a free game people come and go) that Live had. You can't realisticly expect the underdogs to summon 2 WB's worth of well orgernised elite players every night.

There is also two major differences; gear and player skill levels.

For example, i spent my live career on Iron Rock - home to the order zerg from 2011 to its merger. When AAO was introduced it highligted the scale of the issue; 60% AAO was considered to be a good day and more often than not destro took keeps at 100-180% AAO. How you ask? Gear and skill. Order on Iron Rock has very little knowledge of how to play, having reaching rr50+ by simply following the herd. Destro however always fought the odds and the power gap was bridged by royal and warp armour.

Niether of this exist in RoR. Gear cannot overcome numbers, and skill levels are roughly equal because niether side has had 12+ months of just walking to a high RR. This means whoever is losing starts to lose big and has no reasonable combeback. It simply isn't realistic to expect the underdogs to throw down orgernised raid parties to stop the horde each and every night, it also effectively eliminates new players from enjoying the game or playign the side they want.

If one side's winning all the time, the other is only deploying premades at every step you suddenly find the problem magnifying. I don't want to repeat my experiance of iron rock, waiting 12 months for the losing sides skills to balance out the winning sides ridiculous power train, it just isn't going to happen.

i haven't been on RoR but the shift from destro to order seems to be, in part, due to the fact certain order classes have become far stronger and much easier to play then their destro counter parts. It's a hard problem to fix, short of adding renown penalities for constanting taking zones (i.e 80% of the orvr flips are your realm, -25% on renown for the following week) or a bonus to the losing side. AAO is nice, but it just isn't covering the gap between potential RP's. Theres also the leveling issue, XP from orvr is great for the winning realm but the losing realm gets shafted by the inability to complete quests.

I'm now seeing every increasing numbers of Destro taking SC's instead of Orvr because its the only place they can get a fight that isn't utterly stacked.

[dansari]

Or, it could be because large guilds swing the population. Not saying that "buh buh but WL" isn't a valid argument, but phalanx went order and the Gascioch community came out of no where. And for NA at least I haven't seen rocks out in force in a while.

[Luuca]

Isn't forming a 6-man and playing hit and run against the larger force while enjoying 100++ AAO, a successful RvR tactic that's not killing the game?

[Martok]

Isn't forming a 6-man and playing hit and run against the larger force while enjoying 100++ AAO, a successful RvR tactic that's not killing the game?

What Luuca said.