Overarching balance changes

[peterthepan3]

Bloodi comin through with a beast idea.

I like the idea of guard being disabled when the tank is stunned! Now THAT is counter play.

That is a good idea, but I would suggest it doesn't work for staggers otherwise that's potentially 5-7seconds out of a fight/without guard = very fast TTK.

It's a good idea, but it would be a massive game changer, and i think it might mean reworking more things than it's worth. Ranged KD would become overpowered, and almost every KD in the game would have to be looked at for balance afterwards.

True: perhaps its better the 'devil' (still think its fine personally ) you know...

[Jaycub]

Ranged also doesn't have as much luxury in getting behind the tank to negate the effects of block, and regarless dodge is a 360 degree avoidance.

But what do you mean destro has less access to AoE KD? I think destro groups are at a bit of disadvantage only because knight is a better solo tank if you are running 3-2-1.

[Sigimund]

As for guard being fine, any ability that is a must have ability or class that is a must have class should seriously be looked at in terms of balance.

Guard could do with some more counterplay options, but I think it should remain a must have archetype ability like healing is a must have ability. A meta that encouraged you to have characters from each of the four archetypes could be interesting.

What happened to the ideas around giving 2H tanks a guard breaker ability?

[Azarael]

It was disputed that two-handers needed that boost.

[Jaycub]

I don't think 2h specifically will get a guard breaker utility.

Destro would cry about it because IB/SM are good 2h tanks, while BO/CH have to run snb to get the all powerful morale pump. If you did have to give them to tanks I think it should just be a concession type thing where you are giving up something considerable to run it.

Tanks imo already have so much in terms of abilities or mechanics that control a fight I don't really think they need even more.

[TenTonHammer]

The fact alone that destro has no where near access to as many rKD's as order alone makes that suggestion bad

futhermore dosnt guard already have countr play options with punts and pulls ?

[roadkillrobin]

AoE knockdown to decline guard would be the moast broken thing in this game since release tbh.

Yeah just like WPs countering heal debuffs with exalted defenses and how the change would be benefitial to only order.

You just say **** for the sake of it, you dont even think what you are saying, you just make a claim and when asked to back it up make another claim that is even more stupid to avoid showing that the previous claim is unfounded.

Its the third time, i asked you about the WP, you didnt reply, i asked you to list the amount of AoE kd order has on their disposal, you didnt reply.

Now enligthen us all, why it would be the most broken thing ever.

Man, did you even read what i wrote??? I said, stacking healbuffs from Knights and WP itself makes em not as affaected by healdebuffs when compared to DoK since their healing output higher. I never said it counter it, but it does reduce the effectiveness of the healdebuff from 50% to 30% IN COMPARISON TO DOK.

And now i'm gonna explain why AoE knockdown to bypass guard would be the moast broken thng in this game since launch. It makes tanks completly useless in RVR. Pull Knockdown, guarded or not, dead, knockdown the frontline of tanks and kill all dps within 2 seconds.

[Eathisword]

Stuff...

Should playing with a group of friends be rewarding? Yes

Should you go 40-0? Hell no.

Hell yes, and guard has nothing to do with it.

In WoW (or any PvP game with ladders), take a group of friends that also happen to be 2400 mmr in Battleground (10v10), and let em queue random games versus pug... They can go 200-0 easy peasy while being more Drunk then Halhammer. And WoW has no guard. Heck, they could even only have 1 healer instead of 3 and go 200-0. They could even go against other premades that are 2000 mmr and they'd still win 200 games in a row...

Guard is irrelevant to the fact that less skilled/unorganized players will get pooped on by stronger, more organized players. Nothing will change that. And tbh, you can make a ''premade'' with 2 engineer 2 BW and 2 heals and win 40 games in a row vs PuG. You can do it with 6 melee dok. Same with 3 pew pew AM and 3 keg engie. Basically any comp that focus fire and has some kind of heals will destroy a pug.

Arguing that tanks must be looked at because Guard is a must have is like saying healers should be looked at, because their healing is a must have. And so on with dps, heal debuff and CC. It makes no sense. All those things are a must have in a complete group. IT is what makes this game what it is: no class can do it all. Edit : except IB... IB is op

[Zealote]

and regarless dodge is a 360 degree avoidance.

This didn't used to be the case on RoR afaik, was it changed/fixed?

Edit: Nevermind. (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=10507&hilit=dodge+360)

[Bozzax]

Quality discussion going on here. Especially the guard part.

Yep I cry silently when I read it