Return of Reckoning

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:42 am**

This is old school mmorpg, you cant expect to be competative to top bis prems after merely 5 hours or so gameplay.
The thing with war is that to progress you need to learn and to do that you need to lose and die. New games are not build that way, so without some suffering it is kinda impossible. When you got some game knowledge it is much easier, esp for some archetypes. Healing for example is not so gear dependant, tanking to certain level also could be done with lesser gear, but all new guys start with the flashy big dps carrier - huge mistake

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2025 10:48 am**

Nameless wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:42 am This is old school mmorpg, you cant expect to be competative to top bis prems after merely 5 hours or so gameplay.
The thing with war is that to progress you need to learn and to do that you need to lose and die. New games are not build that way, so without some suffering it is kinda impossible. When you got some game knowledge it is much easier, esp for some archetypes. Healing for example is not so gear dependant, tanking to certain level also could be done with lesser gear, but all new guys start with the flashy big dps carrier - huge mistake

It's a fact that most people prefer DPS in most MMORPGs. That being said, I think the tanks in this game, and to a lesser extent the healers are really awesome.

The issue is not failing to be competitive, the issue is existing. I have done my best to be as ready and geared as possible for the T1 to T2-4+ swap and it makes no difference. Including on a tank or healer. To argue against myself, I could say a healer could be better since you just have to manage positioning and UI at a minimum. But the question is - do you have enough to heal what's coming in? Probably not.

Again, me personally, I'm willing to put up withe being gapped and the learning curve, but I don't think most newbies are.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2025 1:20 pm**

1-15 is a safe place where you will see random wb/party, rarely some coordinated play in oRvR an SC. Comfortable for new player.

16+ oRvR - face to actual reality of game, big blobs or roaming wb or same small scale(but geared and experienced) far away from blobs and wbs. Uncomfortable for new player.

16-39 SC - hidden place where you can still have fights in t1 style, new abilities, first glance of inner class specialization, sometimes premade parties. Kind of OK for new player.

40 SC - in most cases premade vs random solo, alot of BiS players with right gear, spec and experience for SC. Hell for new player.

Boost for underlever doesn't work for new players after 15 level, get right gear, right tali, right potions is impossible without outside help and without this boost have nearly zero help for most classes.

Also difficulty depends on class pick, from easiest to hardest - healer>rDPS>tank>mDPS. But still with no idea how "play right" looks like, even on healer it would be tough.

Most hardest part of oRvR for new players - how to get rewards, spend 1h of play and get nearly zero exp\rr\crests is really frustrating. But when knowledge of leeching appears all becomes easier, some tips and tricks about it people can find in some guides and forum treads and probably it helps for some people, for others only own experience with ton of frustration.

For completely new player lvl 16 and lvl 40 are the most punishing steps. Probably more "tutorial quests" like "buy a horse" at lvl 16 with class specific tali and potions will help to partially mitigate gap between new and old players. Plus quests to introduce mayhem-ruin-beastlord-redeye sets.

P.S. Started new toon, 2 weekends(no play in between) - 38/46 healer with 2500+ war crests, mostly weekend SC spam. Now have to beat 40 and week of dungeons grind - will have almost pre-BiS setup. All the way only +11-12 willpower talis to all slots and heal is good, probably lack of survivability, but in most cases right positioning + target\aoe detaunt is enough. But I am not a new for this game and this server, and it seems like OK progression.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2025 2:34 pm**

Nameless wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:42 am This is old school mmorpg, you cant expect to be competative to top bis prems after merely 5 hours or so gameplay.
The thing with war is that to progress you need to learn and to do that you need to lose and die. New games are not build that way, so without some suffering it is kinda impossible. When you got some game knowledge it is much easier, esp for some archetypes. Healing for example is not so gear dependant, tanking to certain level also could be done with lesser gear, but all new guys start with the flashy big dps carrier - huge mistake

You aren't level 40 after 5 hours of gameplay and people who are level 16 still have their save haven of scenarios where they get fair fights. Expecting something better than this worthless conq set when you have no way to avoid sov geared players is something which I do indeed expect from a PvP focused game, sorry. You might disagree but then don't expect this game to attract any new players.

Literally every PvP game (MMO or not) requires you to learn from your mistakes? In Overwatch, CSGO, WoW, DOTA, LoL you also get stomped when you start it and will be low rated. The difference is that mentioned games don't give the player with more playtime twice the damage/healing/defense on top of that.

It's probably not intended by you but please stop blaming the knowledge of new players when they complain about getting stomped by someone who is almost 30 ilvl above them because their knowledge isn't the relevant part when they die to a 40% win rate sov geared ganker within a stun. And healing is extremely gear dependent, it's just that someone else instead of yourself will die for your lack of gear, that's why it "feels" better than melee dps. Might as well just play a necromancer (aka spam resurrect) because it has more value than pressing your healing buttons...

You also can't really blame people for playing dps when you put twice as many dps classes as healers into the game.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2025 4:23 pm**

cfsmain wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:25 amThat is of course if I am not kicked out because low level/gear OR some wannabe "legend" is leading the WB and his idea of strategy is bunching behind a wall as if no one can see or just patrolling around doing nothing. Both of these mean I get no XP since patrolling = 0 XP and dumb strategy = I'm dead.

That was my experience with WBs as well so far lol. Patrolling around and doing nothing is spot on, the renown I've made in these WBs was lower than just spamming scenarios, even if you'd lose every single scenario. I consider just going for an int build on my AM and building for damage and go zergsurfing instead of joining WBs because the renown per hour which I've made in WBs certainly isn't the way.

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2025 12:17 am**

cfsmain wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 9:25 am Recently joined with a friend thanks to a random YouTube video which caught my eye. Never played this game before, but was an avid Lineage 2 player back before it went to hell.

If I can toss in my opinion, we had the most fun during T1. The fights were OK, just borderline bearable if you have no idea. After the 999th character reroll you kind of get the idea and can have fun.

So from my perspective, I finally found a career I enjoy. It's fun, feels good. The next step? Tier 2-4+ RvR. At level 16 (+bolster, sure).

At this point it's:

- FPS drops (my hardware is kind of old, but I can drop to ~40 FPS during the worst of it with even lower spikes)

- Getting completely dumpstered by literally anyone anywhere. Anything I learned, seen or done before is out the window. All the reading and preparation in the world doesn't help. I have mentally braced myself for night after night of sitting in the back of a mass of players moving around like a dumb school of fish, just waiting for XP to come in. If I step out of line I die.
That is of course if I am not kicked out because low level/gear OR some wannabe "legend" is leading the WB and his idea of strategy is bunching behind a wall as if no one can see or just patrolling around doing nothing. Both of these mean I get no XP since patrolling = 0 XP and dumb strategy = I'm dead.

- Dealing with doubt. After days and days of NOTHING (because I just can't do anything to anyone) people start to get ideas, doubts, they get squirrely. So you research some more. Is it me? Is it the class? Is it the game? Is it the server?
The result is 300 threads and posts about how "X" class = dead class and fixed meta. Endless "no, u" situations regarding faction imbalance.

The conclusion? It doesn't matter what I play and do, my influence is meaningless. Even once I gear up, unless I am part of a godly warband with good tactics and coordination I am merely an NPC to entertain others.

I can tell you with full certainty that we have gone from excitement for a game like "the good old days" to dread. I'm stuck at home for a week and instead of progressing my main I would rather roll T1 or fix things around the house or whatever.

My saving grace is that I'm not alone. I have a friend to play with and worst come to worst we can do things together, hang out, duel, try new things or whatever.

I GUARANTEE. That any person stumbling onto this epic game like I did, ends up in here and faces the same thing we all face... as a lonely newbie? As someone who isn't as interested as I am in planning and reading? Someone who just wants to have fun in a game?

THEY ARE OUT OF HERE AS SOON AS THEY HIT 16.

You may cater towards retention, but you also need sales. Please the people who have always been here, but without fresh blood it's never going to be OK.

Hazmy's video has 45k views, let's say 1% of those people at least made a character and tried it. It's a grim rate, but let's assume. Out of 450 people how many do you figure stayed? Looking at the homepage, next to none.

I'm staying and so is my buddy, we're going to see it through as long as we can make it work. But it shouldn't be a chore. Right now it's worse than a chore.

Please forgive my insolence your ancient lordships, I am but a fresh blooded stranger, eager to attend.

Both you an Hazmy said it perfectly! The Devs need to listen or this game is going to die. It has so much potential rn because of Classic WoW hype making people look into playing older MMO's to try them also.

If there were the incentives for new players to stick around it would make the game better in every single facet possible because no matter what it's a net positive.

No matter how you look at it, everybody benefits from a larger playerbase and the ability for newer players to catch up to veterans faster.

You get: Better Fights, More Engaged Playerbase, More Players getting to play with their character's full skillset more often rather than just Rerolling 1-16.

It's such a no brainer. Honestly.

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2025 12:45 am**

80% of the problems I see people having here can be solved by joining an established guild. One that regularly runs coordinated warbands on discord and has active members.
Ask on the RoR discord which guilds are active in your timezone and side.
If they are only recruiting 40's at the moment, just wait till you are 40 and then join. Don't join one of the billion tiny guilds that only have 6 ppl on in prime time.

If you are lvl 16-25 just run SC's till you are 30+. Try and find a pre-made group with a 2-2-2 setup. If there are none, make your own. You don't need to be in discord for mid tier.

The RoR community, as a whole, is pretty fantastic. If you ask for help it quite likely someone will step up.

Posted: **Thu Apr 03, 2025 2:56 pm**

Scragmuncher wrote: ↑Wed Apr 02, 2025 12:45 am 80% of the problems I see people having here can be solved by joining an established guild. One that regularly runs coordinated warbands on discord and has active members.
Ask on the RoR discord which guilds are active in your timezone and side.
If they are only recruiting 40's at the moment, just wait till you are 40 and then join. Don't join one of the billion tiny guilds that only have 6 ppl on in prime time.

If you are lvl 16-25 just run SC's till you are 30+. Try and find a pre-made group with a 2-2-2 setup. If there are none, make your own. You don't need to be in discord for mid tier.

The RoR community, as a whole, is pretty fantastic. If you ask for help it quite likely someone will step up.

You're completely missing the point. Joining a guild shouldn't be the only solution. The excessive grind is useless and is killing the games chance at having a higher population and pushes away newer players. You can't just fix every problem by being in a guild.

It shouldn't be up to the games community to make up for the shortcomings of the games design. Especially considering how easy and how small the changes would need to be to make the game more accessible for newer players. It would take wayyyy less time than trying to balance classes (As if that even matters if there's hardly anyone to play against in the first place).

It's not even debatable, just fact at this point; the priority should 100% be focused on getting new players in the game and then keeping them, otherwise anything else that is done is just a waste of time because as things stand this game will die a death of 1000 cuts slowly bleeding out.

I've played every single MMO that's come out in the past 20 years; I've seen this same **** happen over and over and over again for years. Either the devs wake up and do something about it or the game has no future, plain and simple.

Posted: **Thu Apr 03, 2025 3:08 pm**

Ragnaroek93 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 29, 2025 6:09 pm T1 is super fun, T1 and T2 scenarios are super fun and then there's T2 RvR where you're just worthless canon fodder because of an unreasonable high gear powercreep.

Don't worry most lvl 40s are useless cannon fodder WITH BiS gear, just focus on improving your gameplay or it won't matter what gear you have.

Posted: **Thu Apr 03, 2025 4:21 pm**

Brew wrote: ↑Thu Apr 03, 2025 3:08 pm
Ragnaroek93 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 29, 2025 6:09 pm T1 is super fun, T1 and T2 scenarios are super fun and then there's T2 RvR where you're just worthless canon fodder because of an unreasonable high gear powercreep.
Don't worry most lvl 40s are useless cannon fodder WITH BiS gear, just focus on improving your gameplay or it won't matter what gear you have.

Wrong, gear matters a **** ton, regardless if you're good or bad lol.

Return of Reckoning

The new player experience in a nutshell

Re: The new player experience in a nutshell

Re: The new player experience in a nutshell

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Re: The new player experience in a nutshell

Re: The new player experience in a nutshell