Return of Reckoning

Azarael wrote:Ah, that was because of BW/Sorc (damage) and SW/SH (mobility). I figured that people would oppose increasing Engi/Magus damage because they don't use the BW/Sorc mechanic which is sooooooooo very crippling in exchange for its amazing benefits. Or something.

It's food for thought though. Take Sorc, give it Magus CC and nerf its damage appropriately and you have what Magus should actually be in terms of offensive potential. The question is, how much are the CC and support skills worth?

Other than rift? Not that much. I don't understand the fixation when people that, once again, DO NOT play the class come here stating things like "omg u can't have sorc dmg".

Guess what? we will never have sorcerer damage because we don't have THEIR MECHANIC. Unless I'm stupid blind and can't find my combustion/dhar window on my magus.

Renork wrote:I'll say one more time, just for you. If you don't play the class, then don't some spouting ignorant statements here. We already have enough people spouting nonsense (see sig). We are not a support archertype, the end.

I'm, sorry you cant discuss with people, that have a different oppinion than you. But I'll leave you alone, before you start name calling and pinching.

Morf wrote:Engi/magus just requires more thought and skill to be successful then other rdps classes, its not uncommon to see magus/engi way ahead of the next person damage wise in sc's but lacking in db's and i also remember from live how amazing they both were be it 1v1 or city sieges. Im not saying they do not need something but nothing major, they are just lacking in the 6v6 brah environment, 1v1 and wbvwb they do just fine.
I think first thing would be to increase the stagger duration of land mine and daemonic infestation to 5 or 6 secs and then think about changing a tactic to add an ignore of armor/resist value to there main single target damage ability.

That would be nice

Morf wrote:Engi/magus just requires more thought and skill to be successful then other rdps classes, its not uncommon to see magus/engi way ahead of the next person damage wise in sc's but lacking in db's and i also remember from live how amazing they both were be it 1v1 or city sieges. Im not saying they do not need something but nothing major, they are just lacking in the 6v6 brah environment, 1v1 and wbvwb they do just fine.

Thank you! That's all I'm trying to say!

Renork wrote:

Azarael wrote:The question I would ask you, then, is if you're going to improve their defenses, why should they be a RDPS archetype? If you want a tank, take a tank, that's what they were designed for. This class needs to be made an active threat in line with its archetype.

Could add a *increase cast times* component to Indigo
Init debuff to pand
etc

eh I don't know, quite a few things could be done depending on the direction you want to head with the class.

This. The community/devs need to figure out what Magus/Engies are exactly supposed to do. Imho it should be something like this:

Sorc/BWs: Insane damage. They both have it, but BWs instant-snare and a ranged KD make them better for certain situations.

SH/SW: Mobility. Both are fine (SHs have RUN AWAY and SWs have ranged KD). Their damage is good but not as strong as Sorc/BWs. SWs can do more burst thanks to VoN and EA though. Overall i say these 4 classes are balanced (except for BWs snare and KD).

Magus/Engi: Their ST damage should be as good as SW/SH, with more utility.

Suggestions:

- Remove BWs snare component on Withering Heat and change Magus/Engie snares so they are ranged.
- Remove ranged KD from SW. Give one to Engies (i would love to see one on Magus too but i know how order feels about destro having a ranged KD and i dont want to discuss that atm).
- Increase AoE stagger's duration to 5 secs. This buffs both Engie/Magus staggers AND stagger removal.
- Finally, buff their damage a little bit. Maybe add a +crit component to their turret mechanic (+20% damage, +10% crit chance).

wender88 wrote:

Morf wrote:Engi/magus just requires more thought and skill to be successful then other rdps classes, its not uncommon to see magus/engi way ahead of the next person damage wise in sc's but lacking in db's and i also remember from live how amazing they both were be it 1v1 or city sieges. Im not saying they do not need something but nothing major, they are just lacking in the 6v6 brah environment, 1v1 and wbvwb they do just fine.

Thank you! That's all I'm trying to say!

You labeled the class as *support*. You were already told, not just by me, that we're not.

The only thing I have to add to this..is that this is not a 1v1 game, plenty of classes were better than magus in a 1v1 environment. They were certainly strong in that department though.

Renork wrote:

wender88 wrote:

Morf wrote:Engi/magus just requires more thought and skill to be successful then other rdps classes, its not uncommon to see magus/engi way ahead of the next person damage wise in sc's but lacking in db's and i also remember from live how amazing they both were be it 1v1 or city sieges. Im not saying they do not need something but nothing major, they are just lacking in the 6v6 brah environment, 1v1 and wbvwb they do just fine.

Thank you! That's all I'm trying to say!

You labeled the class as *support*. You were already told, not just by me, that we're not.

The only thing I have to add to this..is that this is not a 1v1 game, plenty of classes were better than magus in a 1v1 environment. They were certainly strong in that department though.

When I say I think it's a support class I mean in anything it does. Not just the CC. It does a lot of dmg, but it mainly comes from different types of dots, which is ineffective vs all the high hitting instant dmg flying around, but it does soak up alot of the healing and helps putting preassure on the enemy.
The Engineer even supports the heals with the kegs. I know the keg healing is nothing fantastic, but it has saved my ass a lot of times, when I've been on low health and had a couple of dots on me. It's stuff like that I'm talking about, when I'm calling it a support class.
Not trying to label it as a tank or healer here.

Penril wrote:Suggestions:

- Remove BWs snare component on Withering Heat

Wait what?

bloodi wrote:

Penril wrote:Suggestions:

- Remove BWs snare component on Withering Heat

Wait what?

It is instant. They already have a ranged KD. KD + instant snare gives them too much mobility and apparently SW/SHs should be the most mobile rdps while BW/Sorc do insane damage and Magus/Engies do... something.

Sorc's ranged snare requires the target to be cursed AND it has a 2 sec cast time. Lasts 5 secs while BW lasts 6 (if channeled).

Giving Magus/Engie a ranged snare instead of their lol melee one would be a welcomed change.

Engineer/Magus need to be brought into the meta either by making them a viable DPS slot compared to their competition for those spots (muh burst meta), or they need to be given some kind of support role where the have abilities that change how the game is played fundamentally/mechanically, so some kind of choice is made when forming a party where you weigh what they can bring to a group over a traditional role.

Currently rift/magnet soooort of do the latter, but not so much that they are really vauled outside of cheesing it up during large scale fights or keeps.

giving them a ranged snare isn't going to solve anything.