Return of Reckoning

Solshar wrote: Thu Mar 06, 2025 7:15 pm Solshar, 83 Runepriest main, The Jempire

I don't think any Rune Priest is going to be excited about these changes, we're already the least played healer on Order side.

Keeping a single party stable is the strength of the Rune Priest. With changes to Master Runes and Blessing of Grungni no longer being unique to the class, this role is now at risk. The buffs to Book Priests make them stronger in this single party role, while still retaining their dominance in warband healing. Rune Priests are getting nothing to improve their laughably bad out of party healing, yet we are now expected to share the niche that we currently occupy - The small tweak to Rune of Serenity will not fix this.

Class popularity and play rates are a strong indicator of perceived power by the player base. Jempire healing comps frequently contain 1-2 Rune Priests, 1-2 Archmages and 6-7 Book Priests. Our more enlightened Book Priests, while not complaining about the buffs to their healing are scratching their heads at the rationale behind them.

It's not uncommon for top Book Priests in Jempire to post 3x the healing numbers of Rune Priests at the end of a play session. If I play well and with a bit of luck, I might place 3rd/4th in heal numbers out of 8 healers. This requires me to run 1050 Willpower and +175 Heal power while taking a big hit to survivability. Meanwhile our Book Priests spend nothing on healing output and can stack everything into defensive stats.

A final note on Blessing of Grungni being given to Warrior Priests. This is the biggest slap in the face and it is flying under the radar due to the noise around Master Rune changes.

To be clear:

• RPs are facing a nerf to their ability to apply this class defining tactic to the party.

• This is happening due to changes in the range, duration and pulse frequency of the Master Rune.

• This tactic is now being given to Warrior Priests, the most played healer on Order side.

• They are having existing tactics moved to core abilities to free up space to slot it.

• It is being given the effective range of the the pre-nerf Master Rune

• The range bubble moves with the Warrior Priest

• The Warrior Priest does not have to waste any global cooldowns to activate it, it's always on

- Solshar

Thanks, you explained far better than me the main concerns about RP/Zeal who are getting another nerf, instead of an overhaul of their (already unreliable) healing abilities.

Nothing in this patch is going to define, and refine, the RP/Zeal role as a healer, especially since other two archetypes are getting similar tools, with better efficiency, more out of the group healing, and far beter survivability without real tradeoff on other aspects.

It looks like team's efforts has been focused on buffing already overperforming healers, and trying to get DPS healers even more toxic, but not really trying to balance healing output of each archetype, even less refining their key aspects as pure healers (that they should mainly perform, not trying to wannabe DPS).


As a side-note :

Role-Blending enforcing attempts is a concerning trend in RoR, since hybrid DPS/Healer specs can very easily slip out of control by their combined skills ; a healer you cannot healdebuff (see lifetap skills for instance) is a healer you cannot kill, and very quickly those kind of classes are becoming far too powerful by themselves (and become solo roaming unkillable abominations).

But if you enforce current strengths on their MAIN role, you balance out the game and allow everyone to perform best, accordingly to their intended role.

- Playing a DPS, you cannot become uber tanky (saving regen builds abominations wich need to disappear entirely)
- Playing a tank, you cannot become pure DPS even with 2H builds
- But for some reason, playing a healer, you are allowed to become as (even more) efficient than a pure DPS, or nearly as tanky as a pure Tank archetype (either by kiting abilities or protection/healing ones), already mentioned lifetap not being healdebuffable on top.

This is this flawed logic that need to go away for the Health (choice of words) of the game.

Endari wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:25 amGuilty Soul was nerfed so hard that for my favorite playstyle(solo) I probably won't even use the tactic and instead use the new Blessing of Sigmar(bludgeon gives %15 armor pen) and Beacon of Courage(AA+25% dmg/bludgeon +25% base dmg) along with the staples of Divine Fury/Fanaticism. So a major loss of DPS(lost AA haste) and burst(nerfed Hammer of Sigmar) for maybe some reliable DPS on higher armor classes while also still leaving enough RF to use Divine Assault and maybe even use Divine Light once in a while. I suppose this could be that fabled build diversity they talk about!

If your favorite playstyle is solo imho need to be more concerned with the removal of Repent than anything else, unless all you plan to do is duel melee classes who never kites.

To me if these notes goes live this is the sad part of the overhaul that the devs could not recognize the basic need of a mdps spec to have basic tools to defend itself vs ranged classes which have tons of kiting potential with knockbacks, snares , overpowered dots etc. I have never seen a melee spec this gimped in any other MMO game ive played. Even ''that game'' the WoW warrior had some defences vs a kiting frost mage.

Farrul wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 8:56 am

Endari wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:25 amGuilty Soul was nerfed so hard that for my favorite playstyle(solo) I probably won't even use the tactic and instead use the new Blessing of Sigmar(bludgeon gives %15 armor pen) and Beacon of Courage(AA+25% dmg/bludgeon +25% base dmg) along with the staples of Divine Fury/Fanaticism. So a major loss of DPS(lost AA haste) and burst(nerfed Hammer of Sigmar) for maybe some reliable DPS on higher armor classes while also still leaving enough RF to use Divine Assault and maybe even use Divine Light once in a while. I suppose this could be that fabled build diversity they talk about!

If your favorite playstyle is solo imho need to be more concerned with the removal of Repent than anything else, unless all you plan to do is duel melee classes who never kites.

To me if these notes goes live this is the sad part of the overhaul that the devs could not recognize the basic need of a mdps spec to have basic tools to defend itself vs ranged classes which have tons of kiting potential with knockbacks, snares , overpowered dots etc. I have never seen a melee spec this gimped in any other MMO game ive played. Even ''that game'' the WoW warrior had some defences vs a kiting frost mage.

Thanks to recent changes, repent can be used in dps spec again. Basically, dps wp 2 detaunt now. The problem of reducing the distance with rdps is still open and, most likely, the developer will not do anything about it. It's a shame that dps dok has at least some ability to slow down rdps, and wp only has a "wheelchair"

Reivren27 wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 9:10 amThanks to recent changes, repent can be used in dps spec again. Basically, dps wp 2 detaunt now. The problem of reducing the distance with rdps is still open and, most likely, the developer will not do anything about it. It's a shame that dps dok has at least some ability to slow down rdps, and wp only has a "wheelchair"

My mistake I didn't see the update. Yes indeed and it would be interesting to know why the devs do not consider this as a balance issue, it obviously is.

If nothing else they could perhaps add Judgment snare back with a new condition, only workable from the back(like WH ability). Imho like throwing a bone to a starved dog but better than nothing at all, which is currently the case , sadly.

P.S. or maybe even, give the WP a short duration speed buff when judgement hits from behind ( 20-25%). Only works with a 2 -hand equiped.

Farrul wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:05 pm

Reivren27 wrote: Fri Mar 07, 2025 9:10 amThanks to recent changes, repent can be used in dps spec again. Basically, dps wp 2 detaunt now. The problem of reducing the distance with rdps is still open and, most likely, the developer will not do anything about it. It's a shame that dps dok has at least some ability to slow down rdps, and wp only has a "wheelchair"

My mistake I didn't see the update. Yes indeed and it would be interesting to know why the devs do not consider this as a balance issue, it obviously is.

If nothing else they could perhaps add Judgment snare back with a new condition, only workable from the back(like WH ability). Imho like throwing a bone to a starved dog but better than nothing at all, which is currently the case , sadly.

P.S. or maybe even, give the WP a short duration speed buff when judgement hits from behind ( 20-25%). Only works with a 2 -hand equiped.

Honestly, I am indifferent to the changes in dps wp, I even think that the current version is better. The only thing that I personally lack in dps wp is at least some ability to reduce the distance with range classes.

A small suggestion from my side considering new Runepriest's tactic:
"Blazing Runes - New tactic (lvl 20): When casting Rune of Fire you prepare for your next blazing rune within 10 seconds, increasing the damage of your next Rune of Immolation, Rune of Fire, or Rune of Burning by 25%".
I would propose to add Rune of Striking instead of Rune of Fire in damage increase part of this tactic. My reasoning is tied to upcoming changes to zealot's Scourged Warping tactic which is going to make Scourge ability (the mirror of Rune of Striking) completely ignore corporeal resistance of enemy (albeit it is rng-tied proc tactic but it is a different topic to discuss).
I should also point out that new Rune of Fulmination, as strong as it is in PTS, is a 2.5 cast ability with 15 sec cd compared to zealot's Changer's Echo ability which is insta cast with 5 sec cd. Thus, in my opinion, Rune of Striking should also get some indirect buff to make in comparable to new version of Scourge.
I want to thank you for making Rune of Fire/Tzeentch's Cry much faster in their animation, but could you also review Boon of Tzeentch/Rune of Fortune abilities for zealot/runepriest in the same way too? The discrepancy in casting and actually landing the hit on those abilities are quite big for me.

As an alternative suggestion to the strikethrough, what if the 5 point Searing Touch / Shaman Equivalent stacked a dot on the target with each damage tick, up to 3 stacks maximum, in addition to the slow, with a decently long duraton (15s+)?

In so doing, you create a unique use for Searing Touch that could still find its way into the rotation, but as a more strategic damage tool with a delayed benefit, rather than a tactical one.

So for example it could be 1-4 bonus 5% strikethrough; 5 bonus 5% strikethrough, 40% slow and stacking dot, and it would not be a tool that threatens to overshadow other tools (though I disagree that it ever did that), but rather used to complement.

After reading Solshar's and other rp/zel comments on runes/rituals, I'll guess make a contribution to the conversation.

TLDR: I like the flavorfulness and the overall design philosophy behind the pulse, duration, and range changes for rituals/runes, but I think that a) the healing bonuses should be increased and b) a range scaling system should be implemented based on points invested in each mastery tree.

Identity
I like that the new changes provide buffs that can't be essentially replicated by slotting 2 tactics (ap, shield) and running the respective heal rune/ritual for your faction. While you can still do the 2 ap/shield tactic build post patch, it won't be as impactful as running the more specific runes/rituals from each mastery tree. This is a good way to shake up the meta, encourage people to try out new builds, and create the possibility of new solo/small scale/wb comps. The distinct rituals/runes also strengthen the double zel/rp dynamic in a single party. Furthermore, I like that zels/rps don't have mirrored runes/rituals b/c it makes the experience of playing each class more flavorful.

Pulse and Duration
I like that the new changes want zels/rps to have a more active play style and shift away from the play style of repeatedly throwing down the same ritual for nearly every situation. However, while rituals/runes are going to receive increased scaling with the new patch, my napkin math suggests that the proposed pulse and duration changes will make their increased healing power marginally better at best. If rituals/runes are supposed to be used reactively for fewer ticks during a much shorter duration, it would make sense that the caster would get a much bigger bang for their buck in terms of healing value imo. Given that increasing the ritual/rune duration to 15 secs would probably incentive zels/rps to perpetuate the current meta (i.e., run 1-2 runes/rituals at best), my constructive feedback in this section will focus on how to improve ritual/rune pulses. Suggestion: Increase the healing bonus scaling of rituals/runes by 20-25% to make them much better immediate, short-term responses to sudden shifts on the battlefield.

Range
Similar to the previous section, I like that the new changes want to foster a play style that encourages zels/rps to pay more attention and respond to shifts on the battlefield in real-time. Nonetheless, the significant reduction in rune/ritual range seems like an outright nerf that pushes zels/rps into a more frontline role that is at odds with how the classes are designed imo. Zels/rps can have a good balance of defensive and healing stats (e.g., see my previous post in this thread), but they will never be as tanky as wps/doks. Given that the philosophy behind the new changes is that zels/rps should use rituals/runes from multiple mastery trees, my constructive feedback in this section will focus on how to incentivize players to grab all rituals/runes while still creating specific build identities. Suggestion: Create a range scaling bonus for each ritual/rune based on mastery points invested. For instance, a ritual's/rune's range could be increased 3.33 ft for every mastery point invested. This change would enable players to have pre-nerf ritual/rune ranges if they fulled invested in a mastery tree. However, the increased range for a single ritual/runes for 10 secs would come at the risks a) of having fewer rituals/runes up all the time and b) having other rituals/runes with much smaller impacts and ranges. Imo, this potential scaling system would help shake up the zel/rp meta even more and force players to consider the pros/cons of each build.

Thanks for the input @shoelessHN, I was worried I was being biased about it, "AM just wants to be powerful", but hearing other people are feeling the same way is good. Although there is one or two niche cases where there is an increase in power (Fury of Asuryan) when casting at 5 points because of the additional bonus - it just feels bad in all other cases.

Solshar, 83 Runepriest main, The Jempire

I want to preface this new post by stating that I appreciate the volunteers behind Return of Reckoning for their time and dedication. The games industry is in an uncertain place right now and the game and this community have been a breath of fresh air during difficult times. I take every opportunity I can to correct players in-game when they bad mouth the developers, people who dedicate their time and energy for free.

Having said that, and in no uncertain terms - I urge the community to boycott this train wreck of a patch before it goes to the production server. Some of these changes are drastic and their impact needs to be appropriately assessed before being rushed out.

The more I read the notes, in particular while researching Warrior Priests (a class I don't play), the more concerned I am. The implications for healer class balance are significant and I'm of the opinion that these buffs are excessive and uncalled for. The class already dominates the healing charts and is overrepresented in the population.

We are all busy, and there is lots of information in this thread. I've bottom lined the slew of Warrior Priest healing buffs in a bid to highlight the absurdity. For those of you who don't play the class, I have replaced the obscure ability names with accepted mechanic names instead.

Proposed Warrior Priest Healing Buffs.

• They will be given a 25ft AoE detaunt for free, this currently requires a tactic to be slotted.

• They retain their single target detaunt, but it has been given a 25ft minimum range.

• A passive group buff (prayer) made obsolete by armor pots will be changed to shield/absorb instead.

• A useless core tactic will be changed to give a 50% increase to the recovery rate on their primary resource recovery cooldown.

• The aforementioned cooldown will now automatically cancel when the resource bar is full (it's channeled).

• They will be given a free core tactic that gives group members a chance to proc a 25% incoming healing increase on themselves when they hit an enemy. This is an improved version of a current tactic that is unique to Rune Priests/Zealots.

• A useless core tactic that provides 10% disrupt, will now additionally provide 10% dodge + 5% block if carrying shield.

• The shield spec M4 that currently damages enemies within 25ft and heals the warrior priest, will now heal everyone in their group aswell.

• The dps spec M4 that increases every stat for group members by 80 for 30s (except wounds), will now also increase wounds and heal for 800 damage.

• A strong party absorb that scales with willpower/mastery and currently costs 1 mastery point will now be given for free as a core ability. It's cooldown will be reduced from 60s to 40s.

• New Mastery Ability - Healing steroid that increases outgoing healing by 25% for 10s, with a 60s cooldown. This ability will affect the warrior priests class defining aoe channeled HoT, spammable group heal, spammable single target heal + HoT, group HoT, ST spammable long HoT and group absorb (if it's classified as healing) - THIS ABILITY IS OFF THE GLOBAL COOLDOWN!

• Their spammable single target direct heal + HoT can now be cast while moving.

• The base healing of their single target direct heal has been increased by 75%, albeit with a reduced willpower modifier.

If you're a healer main playing competitively and you haven't already re-rolled to a Warrior Priest, I urge you to do so now. Otherwise, expect to be slowly nudged aside to make way for the army of new Warrior Priests looking for organized groups.

- Solshar