Respec - do we really need to pay for that?

[Azarael]

I'd like to add at this point that I wouldn't look solely at class balance when I talk about balancing the game. General issues like potion stacking, min/maxing, item procs and abilities, etc will all contribute to changing the metagame and in some cases making abilities useless or of lesser value. That's not acceptable - the abilities of each class must never be made obsolete by items that anyone can have.

[Telen]

I'd like to add at this point that I wouldn't look solely at class balance when I talk about balancing the game. General issues like potion stacking, min/maxing, item procs and abilities, etc will all contribute to changing the metagame and in some cases making abilities useless or of lesser value. That's not acceptable - the abilities of each class must never be made obsolete by items that anyone can have.

Just a suggestion.

There are so many different builds that it would be almost impossible to balance every combination. I switched over to swtor when it launched and have been playing that alot since .Taking all classes to max lvl for arena pvp. They had exactly the same issue. Some unbalanced build ruining pvp everytime they tried to balance things.

Then in the biggest change Ive ever seen in a games pvp balance they just got rid of combibuilds. It was a huge change and the playerbase were shocked at first. All the best theorycrafted builds that people had worked out over years were suddenly unbuildable.

Now you can only build into a single role. They balance each tree and it has been getting better ever since. Each patch they take a tree and work it till its what they intended and no need to worry about problems thrown up by altbuilds. I see more and more mmos moving to this method specifically to create balanced roles in pvp.

A big advantage is you dont need to balance over all. You can take the classes main role tree and balance that so every class is competitive. Then work the other trees after. With this method swtor took faster steps towards balance than any mmo ive ever played.

[Thundermare]

This topic is not about class balance, late metagame and future of MMO....

It's all about respec costs....

Thx

[Azarael]

And respec costs aren't going to change.

@Telen: if I'm understanding right, the nearest equivalent to what SWTOR did would be to allow players to specialize in only one tree, right? I doubt that'd work for WAR.

[Telen]

And respec costs aren't going to change.

@Telen: if I'm understanding right, the nearest equivalent to what SWTOR did would be to allow players to specialize in only one tree, right? I doubt that'd work for WAR.

Well yes. No more take the great debuff from tree a, the heal debuff from tree b and the crit damage boost from tree c for the best spec that everyone uses. Trees actually matter and each has a role. Its what camelot unchained are going for. As MJ over there said they wont make the same mistake as in war of making every class a blank slate where some can do everything well it will be real rock paper scissors.

Otherwise you arent balancing 24 classes youre balancing 24 cookie cutter specs. Trees died in mmos a while back.

[noisestorm]

I liked the Idea of Archeage (Skilltrees), sadly Trion was handling that game even worse than EA could..

[Kaitanaroyr]

And respec costs aren't going to change.

@Telen: if I'm understanding right, the nearest equivalent to what SWTOR did would be to allow players to specialize in only one tree, right? I doubt that'd work for WAR.

Well yes. No more take the great debuff from tree a, the heal debuff from tree b and the crit damage boost from tree c for the best spec that everyone uses. Trees actually matter and each has a role. Its what camelot unchained are going for. As MJ over there said they wont make the same mistake as in war of making every class a blank slate where some can do everything well it will be real rock paper scissors.

Otherwise you arent balancing 24 classes youre balancing 24 cookie cutter specs. Trees died in mmos a while back.

last i checked lots of mmos using talent trees only issue are the games that don't make them correctly and end up casuing nothing but cookie cutter like swg did when they changed it from precu to nge all medics that want to heal spec this way want to deal dmg spec this way

[Telen]

last i checked lots of mmos using talent trees only issue are the games that don't make them correctly and end up casuing nothing but cookie cutter like swg did when they changed it from precu to nge all medics that want to heal spec this way want to deal dmg spec this way

both wow and swtor abandoned them
all the recent mmos ive played didnt have them
camelor unchained seems to be going with a creation builder and limited respec so you stick to the path you choose.