THETA and META

[Aurandilaz]

It's actually pretty scary, the more you think about potential WB metas, you start realizing that racial warbands are supposed to be in the base game design, and then you realize Footpatrol was right all along.

Ideally all racial "magical casters" should be on equal footing when it comes to AoE pressure, but the original game designers kinda ruined that by making BW/Sorc way too cheesy. If they hadn't, we could be seeing close combat caster Archmages and Runepriests dealing decent AoE pressure at the frontline, instead of the usual "BW melttrain of faceroll" (and yes, Sorc train of faceroll, I can confess)
Zealot is in a spot, where we run 1 zealot in our WB for decent Aoe dmg and awesome utility (armor debuff, winds of insanity wrecking havoc in ways normal CC cannot - blame Lortie if your WB loses against TUP )

[peterthepan3]

Lortie is a beast on the DPS Zealot, that's for sure (he's literally a prio target in scenarios for us, if we allow him to run rampant then half of the pug 2nd group will be dead with constant HD on them).

[Glorian]

Lortie is basically the one man m2 raze counter. If you are hit by TUP it is first three times knockback, then being dissabled, then dead.

And yes. The RP has some AoE potential in his AoE healing right tree.
Increased range on AoE Dots, AoE detaunt on AoE Attacks, friction burn equivalent.
You might even combine it with Rune of Nullification to place a Healdebuff on all the AoE hitted targets.

But nowadays you are happy to even fill your order warband with 8 pure healers before thinking of special tricks. And if you then run not with the 3 hot tactics on your Runi you are pretty out. Except you join the dwarf premade.

And yes, the more you check racial synergies the more you understand Footpatroll's point.

[peterthepan3]

Foot's always spoken a lot of sense in his walls of text. It's just that the majority of the playerbase aren't willing to experiment/go out of their tried-and-tested comfort zones, tbh.

[Glorian]

Foot's always spoken a lot of sense in his walls of text. It's just that the majority of the playerbase aren't willing to experiment/go out of their tried-and-tested comfort zones, tbh.

Sometimes I think Footpatroll is the Saw Gerrera of the RoR Forum. His points are most of the time solid, but if he would be a little less fanatic he could convince more people. And yes, on Order there are sixmans and Cntk who want specific builds in one position. But apart from that everyone seems to have found his special build. Most of the time build of two mastery trees to get the most of both.

But for example in a Dwarf or High Elf premade you want that SM to have maximum right tree, so that his spirit debuff is on most possible max to max the synergy.

[Cimba]

Foot's always spoken a lot of sense in his walls of text. It's just that the majority of the playerbase aren't willing to experiment/go out of their tried-and-tested comfort zones, tbh.

Why should they? The last meta shifts in small scale were all met with the nerfhammer. To the point that they aren't viable anymore.

[Egoish]

Chaos has a pretty strong racial group as well, chosen auras, magus pull/aoe, double mara aoe/morale, dps zealot aoe armour/heal debuff, zealot group heal w/shields. Double ritual for extra shields...

It could work in a single target team as well with double magus + guarded mara or even a some kind of triple mara (1 sav + 2 brut).

[Aurandilaz]

Dark Elf had recent racial meta possibility (DoK covenants tactics also helping party with procs), Sorc proc tactics helping party alongside Ingernal Gift, WE in ancient times debuffing target armor so that dps DoK and BG can be of more use. Sorc spirit debuff, combined with Witchbrew previously doing spirit damage, and DoK Rend Soul spirit dmg... all nerfed away.
Then you had far longer 1001 DoK M4, and Sorcs possibly rotating WWS M2.

The question would be what remains of previously good Dark Elf racial synergies, Infernal Gift? DoK covenants in their nerfed form? DoK debuffing parry so that WE and BG can actually land blows? Crimson Death? Dps DoKs providing real snares so that a WE can catch a target? Furious Howl, aiding DoK + WE to actually hit people in melee?
The lack of resistances is a bit of a mystery, but maybe dps DoK is supposed to reach high enough output of dps heals, and BG being anti magic, WE having anti magic elixir and DoK having been able to double cleanse on self to counter all the magical enemy dmg.

[Glorian]

Chaos has a pretty strong racial group as well, chosen auras, magus pull/aoe, double mara aoe/morale, dps zealot aoe armour/heal debuff, zealot group heal w/shields. Double ritual for extra shields...

It could work in a single target team as well with double magus + guarded mara or even a some kind of triple mara (1 sav + 2 brut).

You can see the synergy of a Chaos WB in the Chaos vs Dwarfs 24vs24 event video.
Dwarf had drained AP and drained moral while Chaos had both in the double.
Pretty frustrating fight. Although we, the dwarfs should have taken 4 more Slayers and Shatter some Limbs to disrupt the maras in their rotation.

[peterthepan3]

Foot's always spoken a lot of sense in his walls of text. It's just that the majority of the playerbase aren't willing to experiment/go out of their tried-and-tested comfort zones, tbh.

Why should they? The last meta shifts in small scale were all met with the nerfhammer. To the point that they aren't viable anymore.

Procs were overnerfed, I agree, but you can't deny that they were overperforming, with huge reward vs little effort prerequisite (huge reward/little effort can be seen as the foundation for a lot of balancing on RoR). The general counterargument presented was to run procs to counter procs (DPS DOK/BO/DOK/SORC/CH), but that did not negate from the fact that they were incredibly powerful (especially at the gear threshold of that time) with very little risk and/or effort required. I do believe that they should be retuned and made viable again - just not to the level of absurdity they were at before. I spoke to Freshour about the DPS DOK indirect nerf, would be nice if covenants had no ICD on the DPS DOK himself? New class comps, proc groups built around the DOK - I dunno.

By experiment/go out of comfort zones, I mean exploring possibilities that WAR has. Testing synergies, testing class comps, using tactics that may appear useless but, if used in cojunction with X, Y and Z, may become viable, unorthodox stuff, etc. I'd wager that only a fraction of what WAR has to offer has actually been thoroughly tested.

Similarly, if said trials and experimentation uncovered other overperforming mechanics, I would expect them, too, to be toned down. Skill-based PvP is what we all want, right?