Luth wrote:That the destruction faction has an abundance of wounds debuffs doesn't mean the the BG is weak. It was just bad game design by the original developers. The IB and the BG the class mechanics look the same, but actually they work differently. You have to play them both to get the difference as it is hard to describe, not only compare them on paper like many people do.
neokingdom wrote:the KD should definitely proc off of a parry as well. The 10% crit debuff that they give is the best debuff the BG brings to the table, but if you take that then you can't knock people down. Maybe it should even proc off of a disrupt honestly. All other tanks have a kd they can use at any time, no defensive proc needed. The only other one that isnt immediately ready is the SM or BO one, but it just requires you to use 2 abilities to get to it.
A proposal for a
potential 5 second knockdown on parry (or even parry and disrupt) on the
only class that can make itself immune to detaunts and
has generally a very good anti-caster capabilities (including a disrupt tactic) will probably not get alive through the balance subforum.
About knockdowns with a requirement:
The IB core knockdown requires a shield and a successful block, not that this would be much of a disadvantage for a tank who's guarding/switching guard on focused targets; though i can imagine that a BG knockdown on disrupt would helpful in 1vs1 situations or if the BG thinks his primary role is that of a DPS...
I don't get why people is focusing in KD, which is not even close to be the only mayor disadvantage over IB... as you said the KD in other class is full time available, with or withouth shield since 0,1 sec into fight.
But the bigger problems are not only that, are way much worse than people reading abilities can understand and only T4 BG players understand them.
I will give you some examples, which seems people don't wanna adress them.
1º- Ability Snare
IB -> BINDING GRUDGE cause 255 direct damage and puts a DoT based on grudge which can make up to 650 damage over 10 seconds
BG-> CRIPLING ANGER cause 0 direct damage and puts a DoT not based in hate which cause 645 damage over 10 seconds.
(playing a Blackguard you notice that dot is doing 7 hp ticks in tanks and 45hp ticks in Squishy targets, since the blackguard version do not have any direct damage, means it is 1 cooldown spent for cause laughtable damage while Ironbreaker at least have change to make some direct damage in the CC ability)
2º- The damage in many abilities scale with Grudge or give them big advantages to Ironbreaker over Blackguard
One example is the area snare ability WAVE OF SCORN which on blackguard is stuck at cause 284 base damage and not receive any damage boost in exchange from Hate mechanicand cost 55 AP points
On other side the IB area snare, receive a mayor damage boost based on grudge mechanic making it posible to hit the 445 base damage at 100 grudge aka double damage and cost 25 AP points.
Another ability which gives a big diference, is the chaneled hiting ability
While in blackguard the chaneled ability ENRAGED BEATING hits for 283 base damage over 3 seconds, and making each critical hit during the ability gain 10 hate.
The ironbreaker version deals 520 base damage hits over 3 seconds, and based on grudge mechanic each attack has a 20% chance of critical hit at 100% grudge.
(yes you read right, while BG only does 283 base damage and do not take any advantage of hate mechanic, the Ironbreaker is hiting for 2 times the amount of damage and having 20% crit chance based on grudge)
Another pool of **** are the Ability OATHBOUND which gives a 25% parry to the oathfriend player for 10 seconds, the Blackguard version is FORCE OF FURY, which gives 618 armour and % less crit chance on YOURSELF only and the armour buff do not stack with the potions effect... making it more crap that a week with Ripley in a space travel.
Another ability which is full of laughts is ELITE TRAINING, which gives almost garanted parry in next 4 attacks during 10 seconds hahahahahaha 4 attacks hahaha, and which give 15 action points based in hate for each parry.
The Ironbreaker version is Oathstone, an almost garanted BLOCK for next 4 attacks (much better than Parry, of course) and which based in grudge can cause up to 500 base damage each block!!!
Where i have to sign the petition for change the action points for 500 damage hits in the attacker???
I am just making a small resume of why the big, ancestral, mitical diference betwen IB and BG which make one great tank and another one really bad.
The lack of buffs in dark protected target, the lack of damage compared to what an IB can deal and didn't even talk about the number of dots he can drop in target while blackguard only has Blade of ruin (which cost hate, which require block or parry, and which does crap damage amount over 10 seconds)
But here comes the worst part, and this is the most depresing one of all balances in game probably...
Ironbreaker do not need spend points in 3 paths for be a viable 2hand tank, or even a defensive one.... you can achieve the Self Healing ability in the same path it is the area snare, and that allow you to spend points in damage dealing path for achieve chaneled ability which make you have a 20% crit chance.
Blackguard on other side, is not allowed to reach Self healing ability in third path, Area snare from central path and the chaneled ability from first path + crit tactic and wounds debuff tactic (Ironbreaker can give up the crit tactic, since the chaneled ability already give them a 20% crit chance)
It is pretty clear and every person which knows about how the game is played, Blackguard is not even a shadow of what Ironbreaker can do, not only in terms of what you do not give to your dark protected person, the damage dealing is way lower with abilities not scaling in damage with hate, you are forced to equip a crit chance tactic because hate do not buff crit chance in chaneled ability, you can't achieve a reasonably build because are snare in central path breaks the sinergy of the class, while ironbreaker gets area snare in third path allowing him to use one 2 paths and ignoring third.