White Lion Changes (8/25/2018)

[Aurandilaz]

your logic goes like this;
player rolls WL -> player tries WL in largescale -> player realizes WL has really no use in largescale and sticks with solo/roaming -> therefore WL players dislike largescale...

I'm a filthy xrealmer with various alts on both sides;
previously if I wanted best possible solo roam experience ofc I would log my "balanced" Guardian spec WL and go tell me pet to bite that Sorc to death. If I wanted largescale experience, I would log BW or my Sorc. If I wanted good times in Scs, I would maybe go on my WE. Or play bunch of other alts in settings where they had a relative advantage - say Knight in WBs, or SM in smallscale...
A large number of players aren't just "main this" "main that", but pick their class that they play that day on whether they choose to want to play in smaller pvp setting or larger pvp setting.
Previously WL was locked pretty much down to "overhasting smallscale" (to the extent of pretty much driving away a lot of Destro soloers/roamers who didn't want to face the Guardian WL), now in future, once Aza finishes tuning the class, you could possibly bring WL to several settings. It remains to be seen what will be the setting where they retain "relative advantage" over some other picks, assuming if they get close mirror of Mara goodies, they might be pretty much good in all kind of settings.

[Penril]

A large number of players aren't just "main this" "main that", but pick their class that they play that day on whether they choose to want to play in smaller pvp setting or larger pvp setting.

A large number of players play one class, and one class only. Don't act as if those don't exist.

[Aurandilaz]

A large number of players aren't just "main this" "main that", but pick their class that they play that day on whether they choose to want to play in smaller pvp setting or larger pvp setting.

A large number of players play one class, and one class only. Don't act as if those don't exist.

Didn't claim that, and I know those types also exist, but I guess you have relatively low number of people who insist on just one main only - maybe small number of maximum altoholics, but I'd guess big number of people have certain amount of alts they can switch between if wanting to.

[soliticks]

your logic goes like this;
player rolls WL -> player tries WL in largescale -> player realizes WL has really no use in largescale and sticks with solo/roaming -> therefore WL players dislike largescale...

I'm a filthy xrealmer with various alts on both sides;
previously if I wanted best possible solo roam experience ofc I would log my "balanced" Guardian spec WL and go tell me pet to bite that Sorc to death. If I wanted largescale experience, I would log BW or my Sorc. If I wanted good times in Scs, I would maybe go on my WE. Or play bunch of other alts in settings where they had a relative advantage - say Knight in WBs, or SM in smallscale...
A large number of players aren't just "main this" "main that", but pick their class that they play that day on whether they choose to want to play in smaller pvp setting or larger pvp setting.
Previously WL was locked pretty much down to "overhasting smallscale" (to the extent of pretty much driving away a lot of Destro soloers/roamers who didn't want to face the Guardian WL), now in future, once Aza finishes tuning the class, you could possibly bring WL to several settings. It remains to be seen what will be the setting where they retain "relative advantage" over some other picks, assuming if they get close mirror of Mara goodies, they might be pretty much good in all kind of settings.

Hm..I'm not sure where you got the idea that my claim that White Lions enjoy small-scale rvr came from the fact that they struggled in warband play. I was just referring to my accumulated qualitative experience with White Lions I know in game over the years. So from your presumption of my logic, are you implying that White Lions have unhappily "adapted" to small-scale rvr BECAUSE they were so terrible at the large-scale stuff?

If that's your contention, I think a really easy way to check that theory is analyzing the current feedback from the White Lion community with the most recent patch. Azarael has now provided White Lions with a perfectly viable (if a little too squishy) warband aoe spec now. If this is what people who play White Lions wanted, Advice chat and these forums would be filled with the voices of White Lions rejoicing and jumping for joy that they are finally warband viable would it not?

This is just not the case man. If you're looking for evidence that White Lions are generally focused on (and enjoys) small-scale pvp, all you have to do is look at what they're trying to tell you. If people could remove this filter from their eyes where any concern raised by White Lions at this point is some kind of secret plot to get Guardian Lions back to stomping people in duels, I think you'd find a group of people with a lot of substance, genuine concerns, and love for their class.

[Aurandilaz]

...you really expect some choir of rejoice from the WL players after their OP Pokemon spec got removed and replaced with a work-in-progress AoE spec?
I'm happy there is now an AoE option, I know its somewhat lacking for now, but I have patience and know it will be finetuned over time.
ST spec looks bit clunky for now, but I have patience that it will also improve eventually.

Everyone has their biases, but WL players here can be so absurdly biased in this thread in hopes of retaining their "unique" 1v1/roaming/smallscale benefits that allows the army of two to keep on rolling and killing with ease.
try playing both sides and various chars on both sides, gives you more perspective regarding the balance or lack-there-of when it comes to WLs.

[larsulu]

well , what about mirroring completely the white lion on marauder ?

Problem solved .

In the eyes of Order , marauder are the ultimate killing machine , relentless and unstopable.
Then give us what they want.

This way , maybe they're going to understand marauder are not what they think we are.

totally agree.

[larsulu]

well , what about mirroring completely the white lion on marauder ?

Problem solved .

In the eyes of Order , marauder are the ultimate killing machine , relentless and unstopable.
Then give us what they want.

This way , maybe they're going to understand marauder are not what they think we are.

Marauders are godly in a group. One stat to focus on opens up any defensive stat as a secondary. A heal debuff that heals them on a 5 second cooldown. Armor debuff, no pet liability, solid mobility, less of a death liability than Choppa, Monstrosity stance in oh **** situations, a finishing ability, constant constant back-loaded burst...it's a SOLID class all around. It is so well-designed in an "all around" sense, that many have called it the "perfect class". And it certainly is a great class. Each tree is so well done that it has barely been touched since live. Each mastery tree can basically be its own standalone spec without needing to push points into others. Very polished. What they lack is front-loaded burst, and that's what's popular nowadays. It's why you don't see a lot of Marauders. Try doing the Beastlord quest order side. You run around hoping to see a Marauder somewhere. You should see how fast WE fills up on your quest bar. Took me 10 minutes in a warband.

ok may mara could be better in 6v6 then WL.
but dont forget we have pull on int and is a cast. ( and mara is pure str )
no mobility like WL,SW.
abilities and tactics locked at their own stances.
savagery-monstro build is totally murdered. ( TB get nerfed 3 times)
no burst like WL.

[Telen]

I can see both side of the WL pet argument. Personally it would be a dream come true if Lion disappeared and all sorc were given sex changes to female. Id be leveling a WL immediately. Hardly fair on those that have leveled them though.

[gandresch]

The WL was my main before RoR aswell. I never played the WL because of largescale. I loved to be a hunter on the field with my war lion.

I knew this is my class even if he was avarage at most in AoR. I still enjoyed and loved playing him. I even came back to the game because i saw on youtube a WL video from the older times. Then i startet to look if there is a private server and was very happy that there was RoR. My main was of course the WL again even with those problems at the beginning in t1.

People act like the last Guardian buff was the fault of the WLs community. But noone asked for it. We just loved our WLs with the little adaptions we got and wanted that people leave the WL alone. Since T2 we had to defend our class all the time and the WL was surely not OP in t2 and even before that last guardian change. That last guardian change was a product of constant destro whine.

Sure there are people who started to play the WL because of the new guardian tree and abused it to a maximum.

I didnt like the change aswell. Played guardian without the healing and stalker tactic. Focused on strength and played the class like it was before the change as nothing happened
Other WLs from day one kept playing hunter axemen because they just love the class.

Now the class is gone. That makes me sad.

[scatterthewinds]

Maura are a great class, and as an order player it may be a buff in the long run, as long as WL get the same tools as Maura (which I assume is going to happen).