Destro morale pump - SM/BO dominance

[Bretin]

Derailing is when you make a comment like "playing to much with the wrong ppl are we".
Curious why you are even posting on the forums, didnt your main forum account get banned for trolling and personal attacks on ppl ?

Can we get this guy a forum ban again ? it surely cant be a coincidence that this guy posts and suddenly ppl like myself feel the need to defend themselves against direct insults or belittling.

hypocrite much huh? wingz typing and you have to mention + accuse me to bait another flame war. wp nerd, should really try harder

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

His signature says "Freelance Tank for hire", how could I know.
Guess I am going to leave you alone with your rage and wait for more substance regarding a SM nerf.

[TenTonHammer]

One of the things that make SM/BO so strong right now is the stat steal

How well will the stat steal continue to scale down the line? will it start to diminish in effectiveness as sets get stronger and stuff?

[Shadowgurke]

One of the things that make SM/BO so strong right now is the stat steal

How well will the stat steal continue to scale down the line? will it start to diminish in effectiveness as sets get stronger and stuff?

Afaik SM's don't use the statsteal anymore. BOs statsteal is still good but not the reason why BO is strong atm
Edit: Random source tells me that SM do sometimes use Statsteal

[Dalgrimar]

One of the things that make SM/BO so strong right now is the stat steal

Today statsteal tommorow THC/ED.
Are you just sucking sh*t out of your thump atm?

[Tesq]

the good part of bo is the synergy with chosen:
- bring a bo free chosen from 2 stat aura......
-give you a 2nd m4 x evey 60 sec (50 the first time)
-buff every stat your party/debuff any stat of your enemys just by spamming aoe (which is better than SM at doing that) + chosen also buff / debuff 3x resistences.
-with chosen give you every cc aoe avaiable on tanks: aoe stag, aoe snare, aoe KB+ aoe wounds debuff


not a mistery why bg fall so behind hence i had push from an even more alpha state than currently for a kobs/chosen super punt tactic remove...to break this ch/bo and kobs/sm we can do anything better; ST speakign is the same if chosen can aoe debuff then the switching is easier, if BO can aoe punt away 5+ ppl and anyone can focus one that it's better than a BG super punt only 1 ppl and also takign huge ammount of guard damages cos have WORST avoidance in game.

[Shadowgurke]

Some omnislashing incoming

- bring a bo free chosen from 2 stat aura......

How so? I can get behind the Strength aura due to Big Swing debuff, but relying on Statsteal to buff Tough seems like a mistake

-give you a 2nd m4 x evey 60 sec (50 the first time)

Since people commonly bring this up, let's actually correct this a bit.
Chosen gets 200 on Block, 3s ICD. Let's assume 90% uptime, which is very very conservative, we are at 4200 Morale per Minute (3600 from Tactic, 600 base) 3600 is required for M4

BO gets 4% per Block. Or 144 Morale, 3s icd. Again, 90% uptime. Not to mention that 90% is very unrealistic in just about any situation. 3480 Morale per Minute. Which is not enough. From my personal experience it takes between 1 minute 30 to 2 minutes until BO gets to M4. Depending on the amount of attackers hitting me or my guardee.

not a mistery why bg fall so behind

It's not. But you fail to see the reason, outside your WB vs WB playstyle. Not to mention that BG can still AoE Snare and AoE punt although I agree that the BO does a better job at that.

if BO can aoe punt away 5+ ppl and anyone can focus one that it's better than a BG super punt only 1 ppl

In 6v6 i would rather have the superpunt. It all depends on the situation

and also takign huge ammount of guard damages cos have WORST avoidance in game.

Anger drives me: 30% parry chance @100 Hatred.
None Shall Pass: 50% blockrate for 10s, 30s CD

BG really has some big issues but guard damage is not the problem.

[roadkillrobin]

I think he means Big Swing for STR and Da Greenest for Ressistance. But i could be wrong about that.

BG's main problem is that it brings basicly nothing to small scale were it's debuff just get obsolete by Marauder, and 5 sec kd and Exile punt is more of win more abillies then good ones wich can be replaceed by Chosen wich also comes with group auras.

In Large scale combat BG brings nothing but a AoE crit debuff wich until recently had terrible uptime and 2hander requirement meaning you need to gimp your tank for it. Dunno if the wounds debuff still stack with Chosen one like it did at one point on live but i doubt it.

[Tesq]

Spoiler:

How so? I can get behind the Strength aura due to Big Swing debuff, but relying on Statsteal to buff Tough seems like a mistake

It isn't, if i do a nice rotation i can buff anything with a st SM too, aoe spam on BO help a lot on this and it's easier than sm due to 1 aoe skill more and no 2h requirement. Keep buff the party have the priority and being able to burst better than SM with st channeling (1hit every 0,8 sec) also can do that while providing a better stat steal proc over time make it both better in assist and for party buffing.[/quote]

Since people commonly bring this up, let's actually correct this a bit.
Chosen gets 200 on Block, 3s ICD. Let's assume 90% uptime, which is very very conservative, we are at 4200 Morale per Minute (3600 from Tactic, 600 base) 3600 is required for M4

BO gets 4% per Block. Or 144 Morale, 3s icd. Again, 90% uptime. Not to mention that 90% is very unrealistic in just about any situation. 3480 Morale per Minute. Which is not enough. From my personal experience it takes between 1 minute 30 to 2 minutes until BO gets to M4. Depending on the amount of attackers hitting me or my guardee.

Bo will generate morales after chosen and when both are used and they will have 60 sec CD, Bo will have 60+10 sec for generate morales which is just fine; Bo will use his one for 2nd.
I talk generally about massive enviroment not 6v6, the game was not designed for 6vs6 and so i treat it but my assumption can be easily move to 6vs6 if you want appart that in that case you have even more tools. Then there were calculated factors like normal moral gain+ itiems which currently every tank can have to ruin body.
There is no need to have m4 so fast for the BO, you will need to have 2 critical situation really close, that should not happen or anyway it would be to nerf otherwise cos order would have not an attack space.

It's not. But you fail to see the reason, outside your WB vs WB playstyle. Not to mention that BG can still AoE Snare and AoE punt although I agree that the BO does a better job at that.

Aoe punt require moral if you are using aoe punt you cannot use m4 so you have alredy lost vs ch/BO.
what i fail too see other than 20% magic damages redution that stack with aura?.... with this set up only melee are a match for your party and aoe snare not cleanseable is perfect to block any enemys offensive, you just need a good positioned BO.
Dont talk about BG snare, it's on the worst position ever.... IB get all his supp tools between 5-7 points while BG between 9-11 points, this also include having snare and parry tactic on the worst path since the strongest specable st utility are on 3rd and best aoe/g utility is on first.


Bring the 6vs6 match with aoe utility it's useless, if it came down to st stuff then bg would be the king it is not this way sy. Being you a 6 vs 6 man or a 6vs X aoe/g utility is better than st Stuff. When it can cover so crucial aspect as keep all enemys party snared(even more actually 9 ppl and not 6 so way better than 6vs6 but 6vs x), just aoe snare then punt aoe away ppl then you can freely focus healers with tank so slow that a kill is guaranted with 2kd and KB and the second healer.

In 6v6 i would rather have the superpunt. It all depends on the situation

the one that chosen alredy have? ch/kobs should have that removed.... that would make ppl think about bring a IB/BG and instead i could play a less copy and paste build.....

Anger drives me: 30% parry chance @100 Hatred.
None Shall Pass: 50% blockrate for 10s, 30s CD

lol not even gona comment about"none shall pass" that their panic button and not avoidance ...while doing that he cannot do any cc camon......
vs guard damages only Block/parry work and a 30% parry is a joke for any tank with no block increase , even more if it's hate based which lead to a lot of issues on BG which mean that 30% is more likely a 20% during fights, my chosen with 1 skill do it better. BO can too with passive block tactics.

BG really has some big issues but guard damage is not the problem.

Yes it is, other tank can do more stuff while taking less damages.... BG implode in rvr and take huge damages by focus; a tank that cannot guard and do not buff wide group but only 1 ppl at time and have all his buff component done better by others (and easier) yes--> it's a problem ! its outshined by the lack of redundancy, the too high disposition of his utility on mastery compared to it's direct mirror (quantity not quality), it also have his best hard cc for sc mirrorend in some way onto chosen (KB) with half the CD

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

Bo will generate morales after chosen and when both are used and they will have 60 sec CD, Bo will have 60+10 sec for generate morales which is just fine; Bo will use his one for 2nd.

nein

0s Chosen M4 -> CD 60s
10s BO M4 -> CD 50s CD 60s
60s Chosen M4 -> CD 60s CD 10s
70s BO M4 -> CD 50s CD 60s
120s Chosen M4 -> CD 60s CD 10s

BO has 60s just like chosen. (10s-70s timestamp)