Return of Reckoning

Feedback from first fortress fight (played on Order):

1) Add Healer NPC and Career Trainer's at both side's spawns; especially important since the different stages have different strats needed

2) Remove the random 5k damage to Defender's during Stage 2... Makes no sense at all and just makes Stage 2 a waste of time when defender's won't leave Keep

3) Mark BO's of Stage 2 and Jail on map; add SC alerts for them; add PQ timer for Stages

4) Move the Jail away from attacker's spawn; if they lesser player defenders need to allocate troops to retrieve the jailed players then the attackers should have to allocate a small defensive group to defend it

5) Require Lord to have LoS to pull and leash him to inside the Lord room; no reason for him to be out on the ramparts wiping the attackers

6) Obviously, the Lord needs to be tuned way down so he cannot 1 shot a WB (unless the defenders have all 5 BO's? But we had 0 BO's and he was wrecking people)

Onemantankwall wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:20 am

Detangler wrote: Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:35 pm Gotta say i like the scenario matchmaker changes. one question tho regarding treating healer DPS spec as a DPS class and tank DPS spec same way - how do you differentiate between a zealot/rune priest and DPS/healer archtype spec? all 3 trees are mixed healer/DD, and one ability toggle and tactics swap changes you from healer to DPS at the drop of a hat.

Easy, by ur stats, dps chars will have higher intell/str set system to check em and if they are higher than above set amount ur considered dps

Except that doesnt apply to zealots and rune priests. The class mechanic converts all healing stats from items into mirror magic damage stats OR vice versa. So it doesn't really matter what stat is on your gear. It all gets converted to whichever you want.

The "Jail" seriously needs to be moved far far away from the attacker's spawn. Currently the attackers are allowed to camp the "jail" indefinitely while the defenders aren't allowed to.

I also think the "jail" system is flawed in that if your entire group gets wiped there is no way to get back into the fight. It actively discourages fighting and pushing the attackers back. If your whole group wipes at any point for any reason, it becomes virtually impossible to get them back into the fight due to the attackers spawncamping the caged respawners. The lever is also tiny and any medium sized player can sit on it and make it hard to click.

Due to this, there's no meta other than turtling into the lord room. This really could use some tweaking. I'd like to see changes made to it so that fighting the enemy players in areas aside from the lord room is possible.

I wish the "Jail" system was removed entirely, actually. Put the defenders on a much longer respawn timer and respawn them very far away from the fortress, but locking whole warbands out of the fight due to one wipe is very excessive.

Liandel wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:55 am The "Jail" seriously needs to be moved far far away from the attacker's spawn. Currently the attackers are allowed to camp the "jail" indefinitely while the defenders aren't allowed to.

I also think the "jail" system is flawed in that if your entire group gets wiped there is no way to get back into the fight. It actively discourages fighting and pushing the attackers back. If your whole group wipes at any point for any reason, it becomes virtually impossible to get them back into the fight due to the attackers spawncamping the caged respawners. The lever is also tiny and any medium sized player can sit on it and make it hard to click.

Due to this, there's no meta other than turtling into the lord room. This really could use some tweaking. I'd like to see changes made to it so that fighting the enemy players in areas aside from the lord room is possible.

I wish the "Jail" system was removed entirely, actually. Put the defenders on a much longer respawn timer and respawn them very far away from the fortress, but locking whole warbands out of the fight due to one wipe is very excessive.

One character can release everyone in the jail. Like a stealthed character maybe.

People will adjust to the mechanic.

I'd second the need to mark the second stage BO's on the map.

I think the entire idea needs a rework really. The defenders have a smaller number of fighters so are never really going to be able to push for multiple BO's, which means they will always be taking the artillery tick every minute or so. This means that any defenders of the BO's are dead because as soon as the artillery tick happens they'll all wipe.

And since there is no tick once the door is down, its not exactly a danger for the defenders anyway

As defenders, there's no need to have or hold any of the BO's anyway since the Lord just wipes the attackers anyway. Why bother with the risk to power up the already overly powerful lord?

People have already spoken about the jail being too close to the attackers respawn. I like the idea of separating it so that it needs to be actively defended. That would incentivize the defenders sorteeing out to recover lost warriors.

The portals need fixing. WC? nope! Near the barrier? Nope! Portal in the city? Nope! Other tiny portal in the city? ok, you finally got it. No marker, no explantion... Just asking for player frustration.


That said, not mad. Teething issues were totally expected. Two steps forward and one step back is still progress. Thanks Devs!

wargrimnir wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:24 am
One character can release everyone in the jail. Like a stealthed character maybe.

People will adjust to the mechanic.

So keep the mechanic, but don't let it be so passive.

Moving the jail away from spawn requires some thinking and participation. It means resources have to be set aside for it, rather than letting respawns clear it out

wargrimnir wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:24 am

Liandel wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:55 am The "Jail" seriously needs to be moved far far away from the attacker's spawn. Currently the attackers are allowed to camp the "jail" indefinitely while the defenders aren't allowed to.

I also think the "jail" system is flawed in that if your entire group gets wiped there is no way to get back into the fight. It actively discourages fighting and pushing the attackers back. If your whole group wipes at any point for any reason, it becomes virtually impossible to get them back into the fight due to the attackers spawncamping the caged respawners. The lever is also tiny and any medium sized player can sit on it and make it hard to click.

Due to this, there's no meta other than turtling into the lord room. This really could use some tweaking. I'd like to see changes made to it so that fighting the enemy players in areas aside from the lord room is possible.

I wish the "Jail" system was removed entirely, actually. Put the defenders on a much longer respawn timer and respawn them very far away from the fortress, but locking whole warbands out of the fight due to one wipe is very excessive.

One character can release everyone in the jail. Like a stealthed character maybe.

People will adjust to the mechanic.

So now every party or warband must contain one WH or WE that does not get killed at any point, otherwise trust a random WH or WE to do the job by themselves? Having a siege be made or broken off of the performance of one class seems a little imbalanced to me. It's a little unfair to expect a WH/WE to sit around not taking any damage and being unable to contribute, because their death means the potential death of their whole party.

I think a fairer solution that would be less confusing for people might be to have both respawn points located far away from the lord room and far away from each other. These spawn areas are protected by one-way barriers spacious enough to prevent outside people from CCing or damaging those inside. That way, griefing is prevented for both sides. The barrier can be clicked on, teleporting the player outside the barrier, but they can't click to get back inside. That way, the respawn areas are protected and the realm doesn't have to depend on stealth classes for success.

It's just a suggestion. I experienced a lot of unhappy and confused people during the Shining Way siege earlier, and I think these changes would improve the experience a lot.

Liandel wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 5:56 am
So now every party or warband must contain one WH or WE that does not get killed at any point, otherwise trust a random WH or WE to do the job by themselves? Having a siege be made or broken off of the performance of one class seems a little imbalanced to me. It's a little unfair to expect a WH/WE to sit around not taking any damage and being unable to contribute, because their death means the potential death of their whole party.

It would probably be the most efficient class to sneak back to the jail to free people, but certainly any number of ways could get it done. Don't grind your teeth over it, we're watching. People will adjust and we will tweak as needed.

wargrimnir wrote: Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:33 pm (...) All the joys of being on an alpha server with content too big to test ourselves.

Well spoken
A lot of people here need to understand this ^^

Detangler wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 3:52 am

Onemantankwall wrote: Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:20 am

Detangler wrote: Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:35 pm Gotta say i like the scenario matchmaker changes. one question tho regarding treating healer DPS spec as a DPS class and tank DPS spec same way - how do you differentiate between a zealot/rune priest and DPS/healer archtype spec? all 3 trees are mixed healer/DD, and one ability toggle and tactics swap changes you from healer to DPS at the drop of a hat.

Easy, by ur stats, dps chars will have higher intell/str set system to check em and if they are higher than above set amount ur considered dps

Except that doesnt apply to zealots and rune priests. The class mechanic converts all healing stats from items into mirror magic damage stats OR vice versa. So it doesn't really matter what stat is on your gear. It all gets converted to whichever you want.

I would guess it goes by your spend Renown points, as a dps zealot you probably will have some points in magic-crit instead of heal-crit e.g.

Eventhough I don't think that the exact formula will be given