Return of Reckoning

Group Guard aoe spell?

the amount of times i've tried to save someones life as a tank but i couldn't because they were outside of my group, its sad.

Tanks should be able to guard outside of groups.
And guard is something you should get at lvl 1.

Let us do our jurb!

Eh.. one of the few ways to currently kill somebody in an organized group is to punt the tank (and preferably both) at the same time, then burst the target (hopefully before a Bellow or AoE Detaunt neuters your attempt), then snowball kills from there.

Having tanks outside your group able to guard you, would make this method way harder, and that's not even accounting for your other suggestion to make Guard stack..


It would be nice enough if done right, but ultimately seems like it would need big rebalances of everything, just because you think you can't protect out of party, discounting:

defensive punts,
body block,
Interrupts,
absorbs,
challenges,
M3 bellows,
HTL,
slows,
knockdowns,
AP drains,
Morale drains,
Def buffs,
dmg debuffs

Would be nice to be able to guard people out of party, but people in party should still reap more benefits than those out of it, from Guard.

I'll indulge in some daydreaming and say, give them a lesser version of Guard like the one we had for a while (with that dreadful patch), give them the infamous 25% Guard , whilst those in party still get their 50% Guard.
I'd create a separate ability to make it easier to implement, call it "Watchful Eye" or something along those lines and make it so it only works on off-party people.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Would be cool, but I'm fine without it as well, there's still plenty that we can do for randoms, Hold the Line, buff ally, snare, debuff, knockdown, AP drain, punt away the enemy and ofc... Challenge!

Guard stacking with Challenge is already too much free mitigation, and now you want outside team guard and guard stacking as well. What a great idea

Zxul wrote: Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:02 pm Guard stacking with Challenge is already too much free mitigation, and now you want outside team guard and guard stacking as well. What a great idea

Could you explain, why you think it is too much?

While tank guarding outside, it is not guarding inside party.

Stacking guards lowers guard efficiency:
1 tank has 50% efficient guard ability.
4 tanks has 20% efficiency only.

Moonbiter wrote: Sat Nov 04, 2023 12:28 pm

Zxul wrote: Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:02 pm Guard stacking with Challenge is already too much free mitigation, and now you want outside team guard and guard stacking as well. What a great idea

Could you explain, why you think it is too much?

While tank guarding outside, it is not guarding inside party.

Stacking guards lowers guard efficiency:
1 tank has 50% efficient guard ability.
4 tanks has 20% efficiency only.

Because guard+challenge means any toon with zero investment into defenses has a 65% mitigation.

As for 4 tanks stacking, they wouldn't be using guard outside party if they needed it inside. Now lets compare it to tank m4:

-m4 has a large build time, guard is always instantly available
-m4 lasts for 10 sec, guard is permanently up
-m4 mitigates 75% dmg, this mitigates 80%
-m4 only works in party, this works on anyone

So you want something which is instantly available without needing to build anything, permanently up, doesn't requires any speccing into anything, and is stronger than one of strongest morales in the game. Ok lets think just why this might be too much, or more like a record idea of the year

Interesting idea but it would create chaos with balance. Guard is already the most overpowered ability in the game. Imo guard should have been implemented like in DAoC so when guarding another player you have a chance to block attacks on them rather than just splitting dmg.

Zxul wrote: Sat Nov 04, 2023 1:18 pm

Moonbiter wrote: Sat Nov 04, 2023 12:28 pm

Zxul wrote: Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:02 pm Guard stacking with Challenge is already too much free mitigation, and now you want outside team guard and guard stacking as well. What a great idea

Could you explain, why you think it is too much?

While tank guarding outside, it is not guarding inside party.

Stacking guards lowers guard efficiency:
1 tank has 50% efficient guard ability.
4 tanks has 20% efficiency only.

Because guard+challenge means any toon with zero investment into defenses has a 65% mitigation.

As for 4 tanks stacking, they wouldn't be using guard outside party if they needed it inside. Now lets compare it to tank m4:

-m4 has a large build time, guard is always instantly available
-m4 lasts for 10 sec, guard is permanently up
-m4 mitigates 75% dmg, this mitigates 80%
-m4 only works in party, this works on anyone

So you want something which is instantly available without needing to build anything, permanently up, doesn't requires any speccing into anything, and is stronger than one of strongest morales in the game. Ok lets think just why this might be too much, or more like a record idea of the year

1. We have guard + challenge now. Cant see your point here.

2. M4 has nothing to compare with stacking guard. M4 needs 1 tank for 6 players. Stacking needs 4 tanks for 1 player. It is 24 times less efficient at least.

3. Guard is not something one doesn't need to invest. Without gear tank often goes down even faster than guarded. Guard need close range.

Stacking guard just a time opportunity. It is much less efficient than 1 guard in a long term.

Guarding someone outside tank's group does not add some new value of efficiency.

Finally my old dream of a 12-man AOE bomb group where BW's and slayers are being guarded from out of party.