I invite you to join the discussion of tanks of the sides of order and destruction

[BeautfulToad]

Smallscale only list: BG>KOTBS>CHOSEN>IB>SM>BO

SM/BO:
Worst tanks in the game due to the lack of single target punt with 2h and poor utility.

Veterans with a long memory might recall that the old meta at 6v6 was mobility and the SM M1 leap ability was traditionally considered especially OP. Elven 6 mans were considered practically unbeatable due to their mobility. Unless it is has changed, that leap ability is very very useful on a tank in small-scale (especially 2h). Black orc players were particularly annoyed since their M1 is pretty worthless in comparison.

[CountTalabecland]

I remember a couple of weeks ago ppl on destro saying that SM was going to get spammed now bc they were buffed so much.

Yeah, hasn't happened, still too few tanks on Order and for that matter, Black Orcs are still everywhere and pair excellently with Choppa for melee dmg train.

I don't want Knight to get "balanced." The devs chopped up 2h knight pretty bad and I don't care to see SnB get the same treatment.

Same goes for IB, it is what it is. Maybe increase duration of some buffs but to keep the forums from raging the devs would take something in return that would hurt the class too badly.

So thanks but no thanks to any more balancing for Order tanks which already have few players.

[tazdingo]

tanks don't really need buffing, they just need to be made more enjoyable to play. they have had too much stripped from them for balance purposes. knight and chosen changes are apparently incoming so just hope for the best on those, anything that makes them a more active class is a win in my book. BG is inherently fun due to some nifty tricks in both def and off spec and i would hate to see it get watered down into a budget chosen. IB is in a very sad state where it's somehow 3x as difficult yet just as boring to play as knight, and still somehow worse

as for SM and BO they might reach parity with knight and chosen after these upcoming changes we'll see. SM always has it's excellent off spec and unique stuff like raking talons and snb heals in def. BO is having a little identity crisis after losing most of it's unique abilities but is still the best pure fighter in the game

[nonfactor]

BG has the best punt in the game, no argument about it. But why do you think IB has the weakest punt? I am not critisizing, my knight is too small but seems that his punt is also a "knock away" as IB's. And IB's knock away has a shorter CD.

On my IB I have 3 slows of which just 1 is a single target slow - more than enough to keep everyone around me slowed. And one aoe root ofc. This is more than enough to keep everyone still while your DPS are busy doing their job. Ofc IB is a slave of GCD trap but to control movement he has enough tools and enough GCDs. And CC is probably just as much important as passive stat buffs.

Chosen/KOTBS have a mandatory punt tactic which increases its effectiveness and if you are using 2h they both have 10s cooldown. 3 slows? One is the basic slow, second is earthshatter (BG got a cone mirror) and the third one is the one u get from knockback tactic (which is not really worth giving free immunities). KOTBS can triple slow 3 targets every 5s, consistently snaring the entire melee train while you have to wait for earthshatter to go off cooldown or use the knockback slow which gives free immunities.

Veterans with a long memory might recall that the old meta at 6v6 was mobility and the SM M1 leap ability was traditionally considered especially OP. Elven 6 mans were considered practically unbeatable due to their mobility. Unless it is has changed, that leap ability is very very useful on a tank in small-scale (especially 2h). Black orc players were particularly annoyed since their M1 is pretty worthless in comparison.

SM & WL leap got nerfed. SM is barely played in 6v6 and rankeds especially (though rankeds have been dead for like 2 weeks now).

[banites]

What I personally want to change or buff are tank's Morale abilities. Looking at the big picture kotbs have honestly the best morale collection out of all tanks. Better and more effective morale abilities/effects definitely needs to be revisited.

[ChicagoJoe]

So I have an IB, KOTBS, SM, BO and BG from rr82-rr40+. I am pretty experienced and have been sought after as a semi-hardcore/hardcore tank for cities. I admittingly am average to below average with DPS and Healer classes so I am trying to be objective with my skill level.

I think IB could be tweaked a bit with cool downs and useless buffs. Some IB skills are useless because they don't stack. There have been lots of discussions which ones. However, using my IB as a defensive buff bot in cities I would be very effective - I would generally guard the highest damage dealer (and they could be melee OR ranged dps, but optimally slayer or BW) because of my buffs and protection and would always be in the running for tank champ.

I have only done a few cities on my KOTBS and I have been the champ each time. KOTBS and Chosen are sooo easy by comparison and are probably better all a round tanks.

Just a few thoughts on Nerfed Buttons for tanks.

I used NB for my IB, SM and BO, and truthfully won't pick them up again without something different than Plan B, which while SM and BO oriented I haven't been able to figure out.
NB was really needed for my IB to be enjoyable. I was admittingly a NB noob, so I used it for a buff rotation with cool downs and had my taunts, challenges, punt and certain debuffs off the the main buff rotation and not on NB. Even with NB IB was like playing 4 part harmony on piano, or if you haven't played piano for comparison think of trying to swim in armor. You are just struggling to stay afloat.

Chosen and KOTBS have more time to pick targets out for punting and other things since they set auras and go. While I didn't set up NB for those classes I think it may be looked at as really helpful for conditionals for punts and debuffs.

Honestly, on IB I just wouldn't have time or AP to do much other than buff, taunt, challenge and an occasional punt or debuff.

[BeautfulToad]

Chosen/KOTBS have a mandatory punt tactic which increases its effectiveness and if you are using 2h they both have 10s cooldown. 3 slows? One is the basic slow, second is earthshatter (BG got a cone mirror) and the third one is the one u get from knockback tactic (which is not really worth giving free immunities). KOTBS can triple slow 3 targets every 5s, consistently snaring the entire melee train while you have to wait for earthshatter to go off cooldown or use the knockback slow which gives free immunities.

According to the descriptions, there's no upper limit to snares for IB and BO as far as I know and the range is 25 feet. Snaring three people every five seconds won't dent a warband, let alone 2-3 warbands appear even in offpeak times. The Shammie/AM puddles are much more useful than that. The immunities in Knockbacks, like a lot of buffs, in warbands barely matter (except for permanent ones, like kotbs auras), most skirmishes are over in under a minute. You're far more likely to influence matters punting 6 healers in the backline than trying to snare a single choppa and two black orcs, or worrying if you have the correct auras. If they are standing at the edge of a map or on a ledge (which are usually the safest places for them to be), they won't be participating in the fight.

[nonfactor]

According to the descriptions, there's no upper limit to snares for IB and BO as far as I know and the range is 25 feet. Snaring three people every five seconds won't dent a warband, let alone 2-3 warbands appear even in offpeak times. The Shammie/AM puddles are much more useful than that. The immunities in Knockbacks, like a lot of buffs, in warbands barely matter (except for permanent ones, like kotbs auras), most skirmishes are over in under a minute. You're far more likely to influence matters punting 6 healers in the backline than trying to snare a single choppa and two black orcs, or worrying if you have the correct auras. If they are standing at the edge of a map or on a ledge (which are usually the safest places for them to be), they won't be participating in the fight.

This is why I highlighted right at the beginning that I am talking strictly about smallscale pvp. Two different worlds.

[mytreds]

An easy way to get more people to play tanks is to even out the rewards, i.e. play rdps in oRvR>get lots of kills>get lots of rr and medal drops but play tank in oRvR and you don’t get nearly as much (same with healers). Make it so that tanks get more medal drops and rr from doing their jobs during sieges/defenses. Also, tanks die, a lot, because they are the front liners. Dying loses your contribution in zones and cities, maybe this needs to be looked at as well.

[Azary1]

It seems to me that you still need to look at the usefulness in the warband. After all, the game itself is built primarily around a warband and not a small scale. And I would like to see from tanks equal demand in this very warband.

I mean that each specific tank is needed and important. So that the leader would try to find the right tank for a different group. Then there will always be a slot for everyone and everyone will feel their contribution. And not just push "challenge" and "Guard"