Return of Reckoning

Yesterday an Engi hit over 7 million in a city, more than double of any other class.

Sinisterror wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:36 am

: D backlash is not a real drawback. Doesnt matter how much you cast 2 hots will cover any backlash dmg. Sorc and bw have free 35 % crit and 100 % critical dmg. If people really think sorc and bw has dmg problems

I'd suggest leveling a sorc/bw out of T1 to test that theory.

Naelar wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:47 am

I think what would be a bigger boost to sorc/bw would be to tone down the backlash damage. Both can output similar damage to other dps classes, but they are the only ones that have this kind of drawback.

Well, the trade-off used to be that Sorc/BW can deliver huge damage because of their double-edged mechanic. However, nowadays their damage doesn't seem to be all that much better than other classes, while still suffering the disadvantages of blowing themselves up.

Reducing the role their mechanic players would diminish their identity as a class, which I think is undesirable.

If the choice was between increasing damage and decreasing backlash, I would prefer an increase in damage. However, I think increases in DPS aren't really a good way forward because it risks breaking the class in other settings.

Caduceus wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:49 pm

Sinisterror wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:36 am

: D backlash is not a real drawback. Doesnt matter how much you cast 2 hots will cover any backlash dmg. Sorc and bw have free 35 % crit and 100 % critical dmg. If people really think sorc and bw has dmg problems

I'd suggest leveling a sorc/bw out of T1 to test that theory.

not a theory, did have rr70-80 bw and sorc live and i have both here as well. Amazing dmg single target and aoe. Ae cap should be 6-9 so the game would actually be something else than 1-2 button spammin. Melee sorc/bw best fukk the rest=)

Sinisterror wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:44 pm

not a theory, did have rr70-80 bw and sorc live and i have both here as well. Amazing dmg single target and aoe. Ae cap should be 6-9 so the game would actually be something else than 1-2 button spammin. Melee sorc/bw best fukk the rest=)

Which two buttons are you spamming?

Sucks, I’m looking for a reason to play these classes over melee, but appears from a damage/living standpoint, there aren’t any.

Sinisterror wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:36 am : D backlash is not a real drawback. Doesnt matter how much you cast 2 hots will cover any backlash dmg. Sorc and bw have free 35 % crit and 100 % critical dmg. If people really think sorc and bw has dmg problems when they deal most dmg in the game possible. 4 onslaught + 4 sovereign + bloodlord wpn + mechanic = 44 crit and 132 % Critical dmg=)

Even 2 hots require a pocket healer to stay with you. Would like to see 2 hots combo covering 3k hp loss every 8 seconds.

Sinisterror wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:48 pm

Bobbiom wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:35 pm There was a nerf to sorcs and BW's party buffs ( frozen touch and Flames of Rhuin) back somewhere between anni and conq days.
Only the sorc/bw got effected by the tactics frozen fury/crown of fire and they gave the proc an icd for the party members which was proven with video footage that it didn't have during live.
It kinda made sense (I guess) to nerf it back then when you couldn't reach 10k wounds with capped defensive stat as a tank, since tanks back then got melted by the procs.

If they were to revert this change then it will make sorc and BW slighty more appealing to have in a party/wb.
But then again I am not sure if they already reverted it.

Dok and welf took a huge dmg nerf because proc icd's and proc dmg being lot less than it should imo. On live im 100 % sure that welf kiss dmg came before skill dmg, and double proc was possible and the reason why welf finishers hits 2 times is or was the double proc of kisses. Im 95 % sure that all proc dmg (covenants, bullets prayers, all procs) came before skill dmg live not just welf kisses.

It would seem that you are right about the kiss procs. But I would rather see that the icd was removed for party members on procs from sorc and bw buff, that way the sorc/bw themselfs don't get a personal damage buff but contribute to an overall increased damage output for the whole party.

Caduceus wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:55 pm

Naelar wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:47 am

I think what would be a bigger boost to sorc/bw would be to tone down the backlash damage. Both can output similar damage to other dps classes, but they are the only ones that have this kind of drawback.

Well, the trade-off used to be that Sorc/BW can deliver huge damage because of their double-edged mechanic. However, nowadays their damage doesn't seem to be all that much better than other classes, while still suffering the disadvantages of blowing themselves up.

Reducing the role their mechanic players would diminish their identity as a class, which I think is undesirable.

If the choice was between increasing damage and decreasing backlash, I would prefer an increase in damage. However, I think increases in DPS aren't really a good way forward because it risks breaking the class in other settings.

Nailed my point exactly. Also agree with you that an increase in damage would probably break the classes in other ways. I'm not suggesting eliminating the backlash, just toning it down a bit.

Personally I'd like to see some utility/debuffing added to the Sorc's arsenal.

Even though I think initiative debuffs can be quite powerful, Black Horror is all but unsuable due to a long cast time and small radius.

At the same time, Sorc received a blanket nerf to its group synergy when Infernal Wave was made unable to benefit from cooldown reductions beyond 5 seconds.

It seems that there may be some solution here by giving Infernal Wave some added effect.

Currently Sorc brings only raw damage to the table, which used to be their main selling point. No debuffing, CC, or other forms of utility. Yet, the damage they deal nowadays isn't that stellar. It's a weird situation from a balance perspective.

(Talking about Sorc specifically because it's the class I know best)