Return of Reckoning

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2020 6:36 am**

Both are top tier meta 1v1 classes as dps right now, hence why you find so many solo roaming in the lakes. But dps AM is way superior, 4 dots compared to 3 and the better cleanse. I have both to high rr as i play solo classes almost exclusively in rvr.

Add in dps shamans have to go up against WLs and aSWs who have gap closer + stun, where Mara is much easier to kill and you feel so much stronger on the AM.

Shaman have RUN AWAY! tactic which is really useful, but the power of the dps AM/Shaman is in the AP drain, it's the first spell you cast in a 1v1 and it's the reason why they dominate.

Care to actually justify why you think differently @Sulorie or are you just going to go with the baseless "it's not true because I said it's not true"

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2020 8:34 am**

nat3s wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 6:36 am Care to actually justify why you think differently @Sulorie or are you just going to go with the baseless "it's not true because I said it's not true"

The cleanse imbalance is true for archmage vs shaman but this doesn't matter for the outcome of a fight. The shaman can't beat the archmage, if he keeps fighting and the archmage can't kill the the shaman, when shaman detaunts and kites away. So both don't kill each other in the end. The difference there is only theoretically. When both know what they do, nobody will die.

Shaman tactics make it easier to roam and to escape sticky situations. The shaman can better timestamp his hits but for 1vs1 this doesn't matter. When playing solo, sham has higher stats, as they can use liniment and skip intel pot, due to intel selfbuff.
Archmage has easier enemy classes, as they can cleanse magus unlike sham with engi and mara is less dangerous for a roamer than WL, due to gap closing. You will still encounter melee SH, which you just can't kite, especially when healers are involved on their side.

The 2 weaker dots are the same and AM has 2 strong dots, while sham has 1. For 1vs1 this doesn't matter much either, as AM will kill a bit faster while kiting and the shaman will get less damage from melees, due to speed procs. In group fights, where burst matters, shaman can timestamp better due to flight time of his direct dmg spells.

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2020 10:47 am**

Spoiler:

cleanse is also Shaman biggest weakness when playing as Healer. The Fact that he can't deal with the Dots from Order range DD's (what plays Order most?) makes him weaker as a Healer than the people here in the forum always try to explain to you. Sure he will survive a lot but he can't take pressure from his team beside pure Healing and some Debuffs.

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2020 1:05 pm**

Sulorie wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 8:34 am
nat3s wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 6:36 am Care to actually justify why you think differently @Sulorie or are you just going to go with the baseless "it's not true because I said it's not true"
The cleanse imbalance is true for archmage vs shaman but this doesn't matter for the outcome of a fight. The shaman can't beat the archmage, if he keeps fighting and the archmage can't kill the the shaman, when shaman detaunts and kites away. So both don't kill each other in the end. The difference there is only theoretically. When both know what they do, nobody will die.

Shaman tactics make it easier to roam and to escape sticky situations. The shaman can better timestamp his hits but for 1vs1 this doesn't matter. When playing solo, sham has higher stats, as they can use liniment and skip intel pot, due to intel selfbuff.
Archmage has easier enemy classes, as they can cleanse magus unlike sham with engi and mara is less dangerous for a roamer than WL, due to gap closing. You will still encounter melee SH, which you just can't kite, especially when healers are involved on their side.

The 2 weaker dots are the same and AM has 2 strong dots, while sham has 1. For 1vs1 this doesn't matter much either, as AM will kill a bit faster while kiting and the shaman will get less damage from melees, due to speed procs. In group fights, where burst matters, shaman can timestamp better due to flight time of his direct dmg spells.

Nice reply, agree with a lot of that tbh. Only difference of opinion i have with you is the notion that a mSH could ever kill a dps AM in a 1v1. Sure if the dps AM starts casting dots rather than AP drain at the start they'll die, but that's a skill check tbh. If AM casts drain the mSH can do nothing but die.

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2020 3:01 pm**

Kloaner wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 10:47 am cleanse is also Shaman biggest weakness when playing as Healer. The Fact that he can't deal with the Dots from Order range DD's (what plays Order most?) makes him weaker as a Healer than the people here in the forum always try to explain to you. Sure he will survive a lot but he can't take pressure from his team beside pure Healing and some Debuffs.

AM not being able to cleans sorc rotations is a major drawback as a healer aswell

Return of Reckoning

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