Why u hate orvr

[Bacta]

Lets all remember this is still early development for RvR especially Tier 4. It's not easy as one would think. I do appreciate the double medallion drop rate it has sparked some RvR. I do have some what of an idea to perhaps fix the current system.

1) Lets go back to the old system that was previously instated. Yes it did promote afking and zerging.
2) Would it be possible to implement how many people are in a zone when a zone flip occurs? If say less then 20 of the opposite Realm, the other realm gets no medallions for zone locks.
3) For keep takes if there are less then 10-20 defenders there are no gold bags rewarded. Kind of whats in place now.
4) Zones locks could be changed to 1,3,5

[Tiggo]

Lets all remember this is still early development for RvR especially Tier 4. It's not easy as one would think. I do appreciate the double medallion drop rate it has sparked some RvR. I do have some what of an idea to perhaps fix the current system.

1) Lets go back to the old system that was previously instated. Yes it did promote afking and zerging.
2) Would it be possible to implement how many people are in a zone when a zone flip occurs? If say less then 20 of the opposite Realm, the other realm gets no medallions for zone locks.
3) For keep takes if there are less then 10-20 defenders there are no gold bags rewarded. Kind of whats in place now.
4) Zones locks could be changed to 1,3,5

on paper this all sounds so easy...

on 2) so enemy leaves the zone deliberatly shortly before zone locks and no reward for you...

genisaurus pointed it out well: if the majority of the players dont play because they have fun and want to win (aka zone lock) but only because of their rewards, finding a system these people dont exploit yet still give meaningfull rewards for at least progression, will be very very difficult.

im looking forward to the system aza pointed out devs have in mind (didnt read anything about it myself yet).

[Marsares]

I would argue the opposite as the OP.

With the changes to how medallions are gained (i.e. through player kills rather than zone locks), people do get rewarded for Realm-versus-Realm rather than being rewarded for Realm-vs-EmptyKeep. The current system may be suboptimal, but it is temporary and at least it encourages people to seek out kills, rather than avoid the fight. Sadly, most people are afraid to fight which is ironic in a PvP game.

There has been enough upheaval to the rvr system as it is, let it stabilise and see how things transpire when more people have put the country and gear grind behind them and want to get their rocks off again by having a fight. Only then should decisions be made about further changes.

[Bacta]

Lets all remember this is still early development for RvR especially Tier 4. It's not easy as one would think. I do appreciate the double medallion drop rate it has sparked some RvR. I do have some what of an idea to perhaps fix the current system.

1) Lets go back to the old system that was previously instated. Yes it did promote afking and zerging.
2) Would it be possible to implement how many people are in a zone when a zone flip occurs? If say less then 20 of the opposite Realm, the other realm gets no medallions for zone locks.
3) For keep takes if there are less then 10-20 defenders there are no gold bags rewarded. Kind of whats in place now.
4) Zones locks could be changed to 1,3,5

on paper this all sounds so easy...

on 2) so enemy leaves the zone deliberatly shortly before zone locks and no reward for you...

genisaurus pointed it out well: if the majority of the players dont play because they have fun and want to win (aka zone lock) but only because of their rewards, finding a system these people dont exploit yet still give meaningfull rewards for at least progression, will be very very difficult.

im looking forward to the system aza pointed out devs have in mind (didnt read anything about it myself yet).

Well it could potentially be set on how much fighting was going on at the in the lakes, is there a way to track that? Obviously if no on is willing to defend a keep or fight in the lakes no one should be rewarded.

[Genisaurus]

Keep defenses have awarded gold chests for several patches now, so long as a certain number of attackers were killed in the radius of a keep. Unfortunately, it was discovered recently that the area that was considered "inside the radius" of the keep was incredibly small - in many cases, not even reaching from the keep lord to the outer wall of the keep. This was fixed in the May 14th patch. Additionally, the number of killed attackers required to trigger the defense roll was lowered slightly.

One of the biggest problems, I will admit, is the whole ram situation. There are two problems here: first, siege weaponry can only be set up within the aforementioned "area" of a keep. Until recently, this meant that rams were subject to the above problem. This was fixed, but now the second issue is more apparent - the position where a ram spawns is calculated as an offset from the position of the oil. This is one of those things that seemed like a brilliant and elegant solution at the time, but the geometry of every keep is just too different for a calculation to be reliable. Instead, I am currently working on re-writing this system to just use hard-coded coordinates for ram placement at every keep. Additionally, I'm going to see if I can force-feed the ram a door to target, because it sometimes seems unable to find one on its own. These things will take a day or two.

I expect that once the differences in difficulty between attacking and defending a keep are balanced out, people will be more willing to attack (and defend) keeps once again. Once that is the case we can look at adjusting incentives, but at some point we need to be able to put the whole thing down so we can move on to rewriting RvR from scratch.

Implementing and fixing the current system is more my job. I agree the system is pretty borked at the moment, but it's a work in progress.

[Tiggo]

Lets all remember this is still early development for RvR especially Tier 4. It's not easy as one would think. I do appreciate the double medallion drop rate it has sparked some RvR. I do have some what of an idea to perhaps fix the current system.

1) Lets go back to the old system that was previously instated. Yes it did promote afking and zerging.
2) Would it be possible to implement how many people are in a zone when a zone flip occurs? If say less then 20 of the opposite Realm, the other realm gets no medallions for zone locks.
3) For keep takes if there are less then 10-20 defenders there are no gold bags rewarded. Kind of whats in place now.
4) Zones locks could be changed to 1,3,5

on paper this all sounds so easy...

on 2) so enemy leaves the zone deliberatly shortly before zone locks and no reward for you...

genisaurus pointed it out well: if the majority of the players dont play because they have fun and want to win (aka zone lock) but only because of their rewards, finding a system these people dont exploit yet still give meaningfull rewards for at least progression, will be very very difficult.

im looking forward to the system aza pointed out devs have in mind (didnt read anything about it myself yet).

Well it could potentially be set on how much fighting was going on at the in the lakes, is there a way to track that? Obviously if no on is willing to defend a keep or fight in the lakes no one should be rewarded.

but thats what it does right now? the more killing the more medaillons drop (from killing) and to the people doing the kills.

[Bacta]

Yes to a point, i meant tracking as in per zone flips. So people will want to take keeps and zones. They wont be rewarded keeps and zone flips unless there was fighting in the zone.

[Shadowgurke]

You already get rewarded for taking keeps. You get rewarded for defending keeps. You get rewarded for killing players. The incentive is there. I am starting to believe Genisaurus was right when he complained that a lot of players don't actually want to fight

[hogo2hogo]

Since medallion rates were increased, would it be feasible in code-context that a similar concept with AAO standards is applied?

eg. when you have 60% AAO you get like 5% more chance of medallion drop per kill, 120% like 15% etc? (Numbers in the examples are purely figurative, although I would recommend an exponential Geometric Progression analogy, instead of a simple analogy)

EDIT: Forgot to mention why i considered this as a solution. I believe that first it would give people the incentive of fighting more, and even if the eternal curse of xrealming exists, it would still be rewarding and -potentially- creating an equilibrium for the majority of players.. Unless some harvesters change sides every 10-15 mins according to the AAO

[mursie]

You already get rewarded for taking keeps. You get rewarded for defending keeps. You get rewarded for killing players. The incentive is there. I am starting to believe Genisaurus was right when he complained that a lot of players don't actually want to fight

You get rewarded for taking a "defended" keep. Since no one defends, no one takes. Taking an undefended keep is worthless as there is no gold bag or medallion. So people choose not to take.

Some of this may be due to the fact that people are not aware that defending would award bags. If that word gets out and it's actually functioning, then perhaps more keeps will be defended and in turn more keeps taken. The problem is the chicken and the egg scenario. Which one comes first?

As for rewards for player kills. That definitely is working and it's pretty much the only orvr that is going on right now. Praag skirmishes for player kills and medals. I think this is working well.