Order Tank Discussion

[Ninepaces]

I'm looking for advice on order tanks. I have a Kotbs and am leveling up an IB. It seems to me the kotbs is better in nearly everyway to the IB. But I am interested in what happens to these classes at t4/high rr. I want to pick one and stick with it but I'm unsure which is the one I want.

I'd like to play ironbreaker based on coolness factor, but I'm struggling to find justification to use it over kotbs. The grudge and oathfriend mechanics seem clunky to me and require a lot of micro managing to give buffs to 1 ally when a kotbs auras are for free and don't require spamming. On top of that any offensive support IB provides are dwarfed by the 20% crit kotbs can give. Both have a punt, both have a proc-based knockdown. Kotbs vigilance is a very good flat -50% dmg reduction that ib can't seem to match. Even with oathstone and the bubble ability its damage mitigation doesnt seem as good. I've also been struggling vs magic damage without the kotbs resist aura, but maybe that is because I'm still lvl 11 with ib and magic damage is very strong at low levels. The outgoing -50% heal from the ib and the aoe snare are unique to the ib but is it enough to warrant a spot on a premade over 1 or even a 2nd kotbs?

Anyways I'm interested in hearing what anyone has to say about about both classes and how they develop in t4.

Edit: I have heard horror stories about swordmaster in t4 so it is out of the question at this stage. If I were to play it though I would try to ww s/b full utility method.

[Nishka]

There's not much reason to use ib over kotbs if all you want is to be max useful in a group. IB can be a bit tankier on t4 due to more block, has more damage even in full tank... though the lack of self-buff to resists makes him vulnurable to magic. Unless he has a kotbs in his group, haha.
On the other side, there are many kotbses in the game and a group usually needs just 1, so there's a good chance they will take someone else instead of you.

[Ninepaces]

Thats too bad. I was hoping I was missing something. I hate the damn spam I need to do as an IB... those 5-6 self/oathfriend buffs that you need to continuously apply. If i'm using those skills I'm not doing something useful like punting/knocking/snaring. It could be a l2p issue... maybe I shouldn't be trying to keep all 6 oathfriend buffs up at all times.



Is there any other reason to play a tank other than actual tanking and group utility? If the goal was damage, shouldn't I be running a mpds?

[Nishka]

Is there any other reason to play a tank other than actual tanking and group utility? If the goal was damage, shouldn't I be running a mpds?

Well, control? Knockbacks, knockdowns, roots, mass taunt etc. But most tanks have almost identical amount of control so yes, only tankiness and utility are important.
But I'd suggest not to think about which tank is better and just play what you like. If you really fond of your class you -will- excel at playing it. Be it ib kotbs or even sm. Like many fiersome t4 sm's back on live.
Just look at ib skills names: watch'an'learn, avengine the debt, grumble an' mutter... Cuuuute You like the idea of playing this cute little hairy grumpy midget? Then do it! You don't? Better choose another class.

[roadkillrobin]

The main role of the tanks is soaking up damage, this you do best with the guard abillity, secondly you wanna support the one you're guarding, So if you're guarding a caster you wanna use abillties that either boost their dmg or boost their defence. If you're guarding a melee dps you wanna boost their dmg output and do assist dmg.
Ironbreaker tanks are good both as melee and ranged support. But their main role is more about boosting defence and are kinda single target oriented. KotBS are more of a AoE support class. And Swordmasters are really wierd tanks. They can have really high dps output in the right hands. And in wierd compositions with DPS Warior Preists they can be really nasty.

[Ninepaces]

ib is more tanky at t4? even more than vigilance and max block kotbs?

[Nishka]

ib is more tanky at t4? even more than vigilance and max block kotbs?

That's what people used to say on live, that lategame ib can have 90% block. And because my kotbs at rr 85 had only 70% block under 10% selfbuff... I guess it may be true.

[wender88]

I dont know much about the tank classes in this game, but I do know two things:
1) Play which ever one you find the funniest (a cliche, I know, but also very important)
2) When on my slayer, I love having a kotbs in the grp, because... Well everything! However, running in a good melee train and getting babysat by an IB sure does rack up the kills for me. I'm not entirely sure how and why, but it's probably down to the armor debuff and some Oathfriend buff's I'm unavare of. Heck, if the heals are there and the IB can survive, being assisted by a 2 hander IB is just pure awesomeness!
I think with the two class it's down to playstyle alot. One can argue from now and to the end of time, why the KOTBS is a better class, but that still doesnt make it the right class to play.

Remember - some people likes to play a magus

[Tiggo]

- much better kick
- ap buff
- willpower buff
- dwarf
- healdebuff

i think ib has any reason to be in any group.

[Nishka]

- dwarf
i think ib has any reason to be in any group.

Outweights everything