Carnage V Treachery

[Zabbykins11]

Recently, I started maining a Witch Elf again and I thought Carnage was the way to go since that's the mastery tree I mainly used on live. Here I've asked around and it seems most other Witch Elves use the Treachery tree but no one has ever given me a reasoning behind why. From my personal experience, Carnage seems to have better sustained damage and burst if done right. I was wondering if there's a reason why most Witch Elves use Treachery? Am I somehow doing it wrong? My normal rotation is Shadow Prowler, Enfeebling Strike, Feinted Positioning, Agonizing Wound, and adding Heart Render Toxin in when available.

[Landaren]

It should be obvious why people go treachery

50% crit tactic and your armor ignoring attack is in that tree to buff its damage and cauldron 100% disrupt to give those BW's the middle finger.

I personally think the middle tree is better in group play so you can 75% heal debuff healers often and bypass those 2.2k armor stacking WP's

[Zabbykins11]

It should be obvious why people go treachery

50% crit tactic and your armor ignoring attack is in that tree to buff its damage and cauldron 100% disrupt to give those BW's the middle finger.

I personally think the middle tree is better in group play so you can 75% heal debuff healers often and bypass those 2.2k armor stacking WP's

But that's the thing; even with 50% crit and the armor ignoring, Carnage does more damage for me. And I only have 200 weapon skill!

[Landaren]

mostly because crit chance is low in this tier.

carnage is a good line also nothing wrong with it.

[Coryphaus]

much of WE's attacks ignore armor right? so why do you even need ws bar to increase your parry chance to proc disarm more

[dkabib]

much of WE's attacks ignore armor right? so why do you even need ws bar to increase your parry chance to proc disarm more

Only one atk and from behind.

[Genisaurus]

It should be obvious why people go treachery

50% crit tactic and your armor ignoring attack is in that tree to buff its damage and cauldron 100% disrupt to give those BW's the middle finger.

I personally think the middle tree is better in group play so you can 75% heal debuff healers often and bypass those 2.2k armor stacking WP's

But that's the thing; even with 50% crit and the armor ignoring, Carnage does more damage for me. And I only have 200 weapon skill!

It does now. Armor values in T1-T3 are more or less where they should be, but in T4 they explode. All of a sudden you have 5 sets in one tier, and each needs to feel like an advancement. A medium-armored target in Sov has 65% mitigation before armor potions, and a tank can get up to 97% or more with one. This is without armor talis. Meanwhile, WS scales like garbage, so you can hope to get maybe 25% armor pen, which will just barely get a tank below the 75% mitigation hard cap.

But if you can cut his armor in half, that's better than WS will ever do for you. And then you still get to reduce it further with weapon skill.

[Zabbykins11]

It should be obvious why people go treachery

50% crit tactic and your armor ignoring attack is in that tree to buff its damage and cauldron 100% disrupt to give those BW's the middle finger.

I personally think the middle tree is better in group play so you can 75% heal debuff healers often and bypass those 2.2k armor stacking WP's

But that's the thing; even with 50% crit and the armor ignoring, Carnage does more damage for me. And I only have 200 weapon skill!

It does now. Armor values in T1-T3 are more or less where they should be, but in T4 they explode. All of a sudden you have 5 sets in one tier, and each needs to feel like an advancement. A medium-armored target in Sov has 80% mitigation before armor potions, and a tank can get up to 97% or more with one. This is without armor talis. Meanwhile, WS scales like garbage, so you can hope to get maybe 25% armor pen, which will just barely get a tank below the 75% mitigation hard cap.

But if you can cut his armor in half, that's better than WS will ever do for you. And then you still get to reduce it further with weapon skill.

Thank you very much for the this. I'll be sure to keep this in mind when we get there.

[Uchoo]

much of WE's attacks ignore armor right? so why do you even need ws bar to increase your parry chance to proc disarm more

Only Agonizing Wound and Pierce Armor ignore armor. Pierce Armor is the 9pt ability in Carnage. A little bit of Weapon Skill can go a long way on a WH/WE for auto-attacks, finishers, everything that's not Agonizing Wound/Torment.

[Coryphaus]

Ah i see, i dont play WE/WH so i was just going off what i knew in the back of my head